Piston seal Gunky stuff and before you laugh ....

[Orkney]

Yes Pete did read and take on board
Just for the hell of it went for using teh new old 2t oil as a flush, not as in a proper flush, its in there, its run 10 mins.
The bores are full with a special brew of 75% heating oil + 25% redex diesel stuff. Lord knows how i got it, just found it earlier whilst looking for a new empty oil tub for the 2t.

So drained the oil and this is really getting quite strange but a good learn from. Oil as mentioned sludgy thick on the dipstick.
Warm but not hot engine, hunt the 1&1/8" socket time.
Found one, sump plug would not budge, had to strategically use a scissor jack between floor & heavy duty socket handle in the end but it came off eventually.

Heres where it gets strange, the 'oil' that came out was so darned thin it was unbeliveable. Convinced in fact ive peed less watery than that in the past!
It was watery, very much so & no viscocity or slipperyness between finger & thumb.
Replaced with a gallon of 2t and the start had improved drastically. ngine soundd somewhat sweeter too.

Evicted the trav for teh night and nosed the rr into teh garage. Plugs out bores filled and cleaned the old plugs.
Also went over the dizzy cap, scrubbed the crud off the ht leads. Toothbrush & petrol on the coil all over noce and clean now
(surprising how teh spraying from desperation when it wont start with wd40 can act as such a dirt & dust magnet)

Had it not been so cold might have just fired it up and finished it tonight but not much point in soaking the bores for just 3 hours really

So plan is in the morning(ish) old cloths crank it to expel most of the bore soak. old but clean plugs in, hopefully start.
Spin around the fields for 15-20 mins. (not thrashing as its only 2t oil in the sump)
Drain that, new filter, new fill of 20-50. new plugs and see what happens !
Will give it a thrashing then to get the heat up and shift any loose deposits.

The time to tell if its been a success will be the day after and more importantly in a week and see what the cold starting is like then.

Will do a drag strip vid clip up the track tomorrow (well if it starts that is )

[MoggyTech]

Heres where it gets strange, the 'oil' that came out was so darned thin it was unbeliveable.

Short journeys too often = oil diluted with petrol = very thin oil

[plastic_orange]

You'll notice a difference with fresh oil.

Pete

[bmcecosse]

The 2T oil flush sounds interesting - in fact I bet it's v good lub oil. Don't throw it away after the flush - keep it for further use.

[Orkney]

Right getting somewhere, and learning something too !
Rags over the nore hols this morning and span it on the starter to expel as much of the heating oil & redex stuff.
Old but clean plugs back in and span it up.
Not a sausage
Tried quite a few times, still no good, so plugs out again. They were well oiled by this time from teh residue in the bores no doubt.
Repeated this i guess 5 times, so now could change the plugs blindfold at rocket speed!
Tried it a couple more times actually injecting a big syringe of petrol in teh bores to try and wash away the sludge.
Still nothing, tried the heat the plugs trick (its worked before when nothing els e would) and even that didnt work.
By now though it was a clean oil/petrol mix on the plugs.
Was getting a bit worried at this stage, been through pretty much every possible thing whilst the bores were soaking. Knew the ignition was tip top, know theres good fuel etc.

I'd been saving the new plugs until i got it fired up and clean not wanting to fowl them out of the box.
Decided to just try one spin of the starter with them in and see what would happen.
Bingo it fired & ran literally on th ignition of the first spark

So ran it up to warm as unless its some bizzarre coincidence this could literally have been a case of really shot plugs all along, which had it not been for lack of funds would have been tested earlier.
Tickovers down (guessing because of cleaning the crankcase breathers) but its running VERY smoothly !

Just bodily warming up from being nagged into a trip to the beach in the bitter cold and off to give it a proper start from cold and just see what the new plugs look like.

On the initial warm up there was a lot of white smoke not black as before, also a great amount of crud came out with the oil then petrol bore soaks.

What mistifies me right now is how can poor plugs have made such a difference? I knew they were functioning (as in giving a spark) but maybe it was the twincore leads & racing flamethrower coil that was masking the problem?
I'm betting if i chucked original coil & leads on with those old plugs it wouldnt have been running the past few weeks at all.

Well lets go see how it starts from cold now the bores are hopefully clean - fingers crossed

[bmcecosse]

I suggested plugs a long long time ago! My mate struggled with his MGB for many weeks - I arrived, stuck in a new set of plugs I had in my tool box - bingo, problem completely resolved!
So - well done getting it sorted - now back to the Minor !!

[Orkney]

I suggested plugs a long long time ago!

I know I know was taken on board & its something i'd have done as a matter of course if it hadnt been for
a/ the cost at the time
b/ there is no way i would have put all the symptoms down to just the plugs.

Still its had an overhaul and all the better for it,

Heres the vid clip of how it is now - thats completely cold start (and its very cold today) theres bound still to be some crud to come out but teh difference is incredible.

It seems to like 2t oil in the sump

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbPQmYbGOGs

[Orkney]

Another good news update havnt touched it for 48 hours, its been nose into the wind & rain for 24 hours and just had to move it.
Started 2nd spark on the starter, minimal smoke!
Well chuffed, going to treat it to a gallon of nice fresh petrol this morning

[chickenjohn]

So all it needed was a service then! If you keep it running, i would suggest service the RR once a year, regardless of mileage. Maybe change the oil 2x a year as its all low speed stop/ start driving.

[Orkney]

John i wouldnt say that to be honest, at least not in the strictest terms but overall yes.
Its been off the road for 5 years now approx. And 2 winters of that its had starting problems. History is even when running and on the road in tip top shape it had a sporadic starting problem now and then.
6 years ago did an ecu swap with another one on the island and my ecu ran the other one just fine but it still had the mechanic baffled.
He went back to it a week later and it started - same has happened to me, spend days mucking with this and that, lose patience and walk away, walk past it some time later and damn thing would start.
I can say though that i dont recall changing the plugs on it for 8 years and that really is my own daft penny pinching and neglect.

I'm beginning to wonder as its only for very short use wheter i migth be better off finding the standard coil instead of the flame thrower thingy, if in fact that migth degrade the plugs at all?

Oil change more frequently yes definitely, but will be changing scabbytrav over to r40 very shortly and will salvage that on the oil changes, filter it by the wick method (mentioned that on another thread i cant find, tried it and it works) and bung that in the rr second hand but clear, will still probably be better oil than cheapy new stuff.

Just been for a rip up the tracks and fields with it and its truly a different engine, half of me is kicking myself for not just buying what may have been needed in the first place and the other half is hopeing like heck that its finally fixed - i'll trust it after it starts faultlessly the next couple of times it snows.

Oh and as an intresting footnote its still running on the old (but new) 2 stroke oil as a flush before i do the oil and filter - the exhaust smells really interesting !!! Never thought 24 years later I'd get a souped up moped flashback

[biker_bits]

Glad ou got it sorted!
Once I bought a brand new set of plugs (NGK) for my BMWK75 bike, which has been stood for a while. Normally it has been very good starting after a long 'break'. That time - no go! Plugs appeared to spark when removed. Very odd I thought.
Long story short (after I nearly went for expensive electronic things) - put an old set of spark plugs in - and it fired first time!
Lesson? Even new plugs can be duff. If you're unlucky enough, you'll end up with a complete set of dead plugs, not only one!

[Orkney]

Correct biker_bits - a wise lesson is never assume that just because something is new that it works.
Been doing some interesting reading on spark plugs, and it does indeed seem that they can 'Go Off' and degrade over time.
Going to set up a coil on the bench and see if i cant do some experiments about this, compare new and old and look at leads too. Should make an interesting thread if i can get it photographed (or better still work out how to join video clips).

[biker_bits]

Spark plug core that runs between the top (HT lead connector) and the electrode at the bottom can break up - completely or partially. Sometimes due to wear and tear in use or impacts during packing and delivery.
Also, a dead plug may well work in normal atmosferic pressure, but fail at high pressure inside the engine. This is due to higher current required to make the spark jump the gap under high pressure.

[Orkney]

Well thats something i was discussing with someone the other week - and spookily here on my desk is an old plug i snapped the other day, and inside teh ceramic is this little grey carbony (not sure if thats a word but it is now ) rod which i assume has a wire/electrode inside.
Some stuff i was reading said that teh biggst aggro plugs have is getting rid of the heat - and it all goes over that part so no surprise they degrade.
Going to grind a few open and get to the bottom of all that !

Also, a dead plug may well work in normal atmosferic pressure, but fail at high pressure inside the engine.

Well yes theres that - but also i was under a misguided confusion.
Engine starts poorly after days standing, lumpy fires eratically on 4 maybe 5 cyls. Get it hot it would fire on all 8.
All the time my stupid brain is putting the blame on damp be it around the coil/dizzy or any number of electronic components.
But obviously that wasnt the case, it had to be the plugs getting warm and startiing to work properly.
Makes perfect sense now - in another thread i was talking about hey you know putting your spark plugs in the oven helps when you cant get it started - people even agreed.
So next time I'll know that its a sure sign the plugs are duff.

Yup spark plugs are a mystery that need solving, never did trust the blighters since i melted one in a very souped up metro and even the teccy people at splitfire couldnt explain that one away!

[plastic_orange]

I wouldn't use a splitfire ever again - very unreliable in my opinion.

Pete

[Orkney]

Quick update... used it a lot yesterday, hadnt started it in 2 days, been lashed by rain and hail & gales.
It started perfectly ! Eliminated my worries about electronics damp now.

It had a good couple hours running time lugging fencing stuff around, half that time was low range diff lock in the swampier areas (which seems to be most places at the moment) so it saw some near normal revs.
Was pretty grateful for the heater too

Anyway, its faultless running wise, and another observation is that its barely sniffing petrol compared to how it was. All the attempted starts, leaving it running to get warm, leaving it running for fear it wouldnt start again was eating fuel faster than i could afford to put the stuff in.

Reckon feeding it 2 gallons a week will be more than needed so should see the tank gradually fill up.

Another similar day today probably and then can think about removing the 2 stroke flush and changing the filter, will make a good deal of difference should think.
Nice smell using 2 stroke as engine oil