Piston seal Gunky stuff and before you laugh ....

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 7:24 pm

Yes - heating oil will be fine.

Post by **Matt** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 8:56 pm

heating oil is very very similar to (red) diesel and its not unknown for people to put it in their cars

Post by **MarkyB** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:08 pm

How about another video of whatever smoke comes out once its warmed up?
That would show if the rings are shot.
If its running rich at tickover it might be the cause because of the way you are using it.
Maybe a set of hotter running plugs would stay clean in these circumstances.

Post by **bigginger** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:11 pm

I thought it was agreed that it didn't look like oil smoke - wasn't it? Also don't understand why hotter running plugs would help - I thought the problem was that it was being started, then stopped after a short time, so the engine isn't getting hot
a

Post by **MarkyB** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:35 pm

I started by re-reading the first post where it says:

"Half the trouble is it doesn't get a good thrashing like it did when on the road, mostly its ticking over in park or 1st."

The video showed it running with the cold start injector working on a freezing cold day.
A video of revving the engine once it had warmed up would show of it is oil that is fouling the plugs or rich mixture.
As the car is being used in an unusual way I think hotter plugs might help.

Post by **bigginger** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:39 pm

Fair enough. I try to shut up about mechanical things and let the keyboard warriors do their thing - I'll do that now
a

Post by **Spag** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 7:06 am

Orkney wrote: Cold injector is fine once its up to temp it knocks off. can prove that by disconnecting it at warm idle and no change.

How are you disconnecting it ?

If the injector itself is leaky then unplugging it from the loom isn't likely to change the symptoms. Or do you mean you blanked the fuel feed to it ?

For reasons of bonnet clearance in the V8Mini I removed the cold start injector and blanked the hole. Made no difference to the starting using the std ECU & flapper etc... (Yes the injector did work

)

Post by **Orkney** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 7:42 am

By disconnecting the power plug to the sensor on the plenum (click on plug jobby)
'Think' this works, had a problem with it a few years ago sticking on and causing hot start problems and the spanner said that swithed it off.

BG Although because of the poor quality of the clip its not obvious that it is, but it IS oil smoke - seriously like starting a diesel to begin with.
Its fair to say it doesnt get hot, but it does get and remain warm throughout the day (ie arely getting back to properly cold) due to the frequent but generally short numerous usages. 1/4 mile here stop for an hour or less, same again etc etc.
Edit - forgot to say BG many here self included appreciate your advice & experience, you come up with some BRILLIANT solutions regularly and your advice is always taken on board !

It goes to normal exhaust colour after a couple of mins.
If left for 4 or 5 hours it will be dark on start but nowhere near as bad as the first start of the day.

Plan of action ... Friday afternoon plugs out, get say 100mm of heating oil in each bore.
Check the crankcase venting - this is something i've overlooked.
Clean the old plugs one more time.
Sat morning fetch new set of bog standard cheap plugs, oil + filter.
Get majority of oil out of the bores by cranking with plugs out.
Fit old plugs and use normally for the day. (just in case any heating oil residue / gunk cruds up the plugs)
Sunday change plugs, oil & filter and see whats what.

Its not so much a matter of scrooginess anymore, more a case of i really dont want this thing to beat me

Post by **rayofleamington** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 9:12 pm

yup - just white/black smoke (my cold start smoke is nearly as blue as PO's car! - but it's designed to be like that...).
The black is hopefully just mixture problems. Or the fuel is cacky, and you never get enough of a run to remove the acids and slime from the combustion chamber.

I'm amazed you're still running the old junker - surely you could buy an old tractor for less than it costs to keep pouring fuel in the stRange Rover? I did my best to get rid of it for you last summer but you made us bring it back ;-)

Maybe you should buy a tatty minor pick up instead?

Post by **plastic_orange** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:42 pm

You'll easily sell the engine on to a worthy Minor recipient when you decide to break the RR.

Pete

Post by **bigginger** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:52 pm

Bagsy me!

a

Post by **Orkney** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 8:13 am

I'm amazed you're still running the old junker - surely you could buy an old tractor for less than it costs to keep pouring fuel in the stRange Rover? I did my best to get rid of it for you last summer but you made us bring it back

Not as amazed as me Ray - hey its functional. Hopefully will still be going next time your up.
I bought a new tractor few years ago, never had anywhere to keep it at the time so got shot before it deteriorated any more from being outside.
Thats why i built the garage for the trav, it just wouldnt have lasted.
Just cant afford to replace tractor unfortunately but i can always borrow one when needed.

its better than a pickup - weather & all, handy for the animal feed delivery etc keeps the sacks dry.

Yes the front bumber - i know where it is - in about 2 ft of mud down at the loch

Engine wise - if i can get it running reliably then will keep it come the day the chassis falls to bits. Literally intend to drive it into teh ground. Would one day like to do a pickup ground up resto, but to be honest i could never see being able to afford to run a v8 on the road again.

Post by **Orkney** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 8:45 am

Brainwave !!!

Just looking at this link on the oils thread
http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html

I rekon i might just have a sludge problem too ! given that changing the oil at the weekend should i flush the thing out? Know factors sell the stuff, dont know how much it is but might be worth doing?

Dont suppose heating oil would do the trick would it ?[/url]

Post by **plastic_orange** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 9:12 am

I wouldn't use engine flush on a Rover V8 as you will just drag sludge (look in Rocker covers to see if you have a problem first) through your engine causing worse damage.
Just check all breathers are free, then run engine till fully hot, drain oil, then dose bores with your heating oil and leave for a day. Once this is done, drain sump again, change filter and fill with fresh oil. You can then turn it over on the starter to build pressure and evacuate any residue from bores. Fit new plugs and you should be fine.

Pete

Post by **Spag** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 9:22 am

Did you pull off a rocker cover for a goo check (or a bit scared to look

)?

Heating oil is def v. good at dissolving the goo, but maybe not ideal to mix with oil in a running engine?

Post by **Orkney** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 9:58 am

Going to have a look under one of the rockers later - maent to yesterday but never got round to it check the breather etc. Cant believe i must have overlooked that for so many years

just thinking about it now i'm getting optomistic that its crap in the bores rathr than an oil problem, reason being that it doesnt use a drop of the stuff ! level on the dip is the exact same as when i last changed it about 4 years ago !

Post by **Orkney** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:55 am

Update, just whipped the crancase breather off - YUK is all i can say, the sponge was pretty much SOLID only just resembling a liquid oil.
Had a look in th flame trap on the opposite rocker cover by removing the pipe, thats equally gunked so going to give it a spray of penetrant and see if i can get it to unscrew from the cover. Its ony wire dish scourer type stuff so will clean with petrol.

Looking through the oil filler cap the vave shaft & rockers look a bit gunky, but clean enough down at the base of the valve i can see.

Post by **Orkney** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:21 pm

Another update... got the flame trap off eventually without it breaking, vry strange - but interesting, it was excedly dry and blocked pretty much with rusty dust.
Didnt have to wash it wih petrol just whacked the steel stuff on the bench. You cant see in down on that side when its out because of a plate, but there was no oil there wher you would expect.

Had another brainwave, remebered ive got about 25 gallons of new 2 stroke oil sat in a tub, going to use that to flush the engine. cant see it doing any harm, and if it looks a bit thick chuck a little heating oil in with it, reckon thers a fair chance it will do more good than harm.
The oil on th dipstick really is thick black and horrible so its going to need a flush of some description.
Will do that this afternoon, give it a very gentle run, leave over night then drain and new oil in the morning.

Never know that could be half the trouble, oil so thick its not getting where needed on start. Changes are the filters blocked something crazy too.

Post by **MarkyB** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 5:27 pm

If you have some diesel engine oil you could run that for a while.
Its packed with detergents and made to keep soot in suspension.Should help clean things up.

Post by **plastic_orange** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 6:10 pm

Please read my previous post on what to do before you embark on your plan of action.
Rovers don't really put much oil up in the rocker area at the best of times - just get it all hot and drain the oil. I'd rather use cheap 20/50 a few times to get it all clean than risk a flush.

Pete