Morris Minor Owners Club

Hi,
The battery went flat on my Traveller so I took it out and charged it for 24 hrs. I've put it back in and it now turns over but won't start. I've tried starting it many times with and without choke but it won't start. Sometimes it starts for a couple of revs but then stops (and those revs sound very weak). The fuel pump is ticking so that seems to be working. What should I do?

Thanks,
James

Why did the battery go flat ? It may be a clue to what's wrong. If the pump ticks - then it points to spark failure. So the usual routine - is there a spark at the plugs ? Points gap? Dampness - maybe it all needs drying out - and the plugs may be wet with fuel now - take them out and dry them. But don't mix up the plug lead order! I assume you haven't lost that already? Always mark #1 plug lead - a small tie-wrap works neatly....

I'm not sure why the battery went flat as I've only had the car for a week. I assumed that it was probably low on charge anyway and that it went flat because I've started the car a lot of times but not taken it for a drive to charge it up again. How should I check for a spark? Do I just remove a plug and turn the engine over?

Thanks

First off try starting it with the choke, so pull it out full then slide it back one click ,you may simply be flooding the engine with too much fuel, it is unlikely to start without any choke when its cold.
If that doesn't work report back and I am sure more info will be forthcoming.

Yes - remove a plug and lay it on the block - still connected of course - Ign on - and turn the engine on the handle while watching carefully..

I went out earlier and got a spark plug wrench and a feeler gauge. I then took the plugs out one by one and turned the engine over by hand (is it meant to be so hard?), I also gapped them while they were out. Plugs 1,2 and 3 were sparking (a yellow spark) but 4 wasn't. I swapped around the plugs and leads and found that the spark plug on 4 wasn't working. The spark plugs are black at the ends (picture attached). After I replaced the plugs I tried starting the engine again but to no avail.

Next I removed the distributor cap and rotor arm. The rotor arm is slightly broken in that the metal bit can be removed from the plastic bit. However, when seated, they do not separate so I don't think this would cause a problem. I then gapped the points. They were far too close together when fully open, almost touching. They are also quite black and have a pit in the middle of each contact. After I'd set the gap and replaced the rotor arm and cap I tried turning over the engine again. After a few tries it started (although it sounds rather uneven and rattly).

I noticed when the engine was running that there was white vapour coming out of the engine. I went and looked and found that it was coming from around both the exhaust pipe and the manifold. I thought that this might be leaking exhaust but it continued after the engine had stopped and faded once I restarted it and ran it for a while. I assume that this was just condensation evaporating. The exhaust was also puffing out quite a lot of smoke when revved.

Another thing that happened (which has rather worried me) is that when I was checking spark plug 3, liquid spat out through the spark plug hole when I quickly turned the engine over. I assumed this was petrol at first but on closer inspection it seemed like rusty water. Is this possible? It has rained very heavily here if that could cause it.I'm now worried that there's water in the engine and that it's a wright off!

I'm currently uploading videos of the engine running to youtube. I'll post the link as soon as they're done.

So, any suggestions on what might be causing my (many :/ ) problems?

Many thanks in advance,
James

Looks like the picture didn't work. I'll try again.[frame][/frame]

You should renew that rotor arm asap. Water coming out is extremely ominous.....may be leaking head gasket - or cracked head.... Try again tomorrow - same plug out and churn it over - if you again get water - off with it's head. Also check with rad cap off - when engine idling - is there bubbling/fumes coming up through the water ?

Here are the videos I took. The first is of the engine running and the second is of the vapour.

Engine running:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyVu0FReHxQ

Vapour:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BLvTzzJ0Pg

Does that sound like it's only firing on three cylinders?

Does that sound like it's only firing on three cylinders?

Yes it does, do you have some imperial spanners and sockets because the head needs to come off.

I should be getting some spanners tomorrow. Why does the head need to come off?

Is that after you sorted out the spark plugs? It's not necessarily on three...just seems like it's 'rich' and there is an awful rattle..... Is there any oil in the engine ??? Lift the idle speed slightly and take another vid when it's warmed up and running a bit faster please.

That's after I did the spark plugs and points. As I said, the spark plug on 4 seems to be broken so I assume that it's not firing on 4. It being rich would tie in with the sooty spark plugs. As for the pitted black points, should I change those and the condenser along with the plugs? That loud rattle is the bonnet hinge rattling. There's definitely oil in the engine. Also, does that white vapour look like evaporating condensation to you?

It looked like water vapour, did you drive it in the rain before you made the vid?

I din't drive it in the rain but it has been raining a lot and it was a bit damp in there. I just started it up again and it made a LOT of white smoke out the exhaust :/

It does sound like head gasket I'm afraid But it's not a difficult job.

There's no water/creamy substance in the oil though :/

James k wrote:There's no water/creamy substance in the oil though :/

Head gasket failure doesn't always mean the oil and the tHe water will mix, in this case it looks like you have a water leak into the bore, not into the oil.

Al

As BMC said earlier check the cylinder that was spraying water out in the morning to see if it does the same, and take the radiator cap off to see if you can see bubbles as you rev the engine. Gaskets can fail in different places, it looks like yours has gone between a waterway and a cylinder.

Be very careful, I wouldn't attempt to run that again until you get the head off. If there is a lot of water in a bore and you try and start it you can properly smash the engine. It's already banging and rattling but that might be the vibration we are hearing.

Deffo don't start it with a plug installed in a bore that is known to be getting water inside it.
Al