Strengthened engine mounts

[Suzukimorris]

Hi guys, taking the Suzuki engine out and putting in the supercharged a+ so taking out my lovely bespoke 5mm Suzuki engine mounts I had knocked up and looking at the thickness difference. Has anybody strengthened up there original morris mounts? Looking at them I'm wondering if I can just box fold a 5mm steel sleeve to slide over the top - I like the form of the originals and am trying to keep the morris a little sleeper-esque and standard looking to the untrained eye? There gonna take about 120bhp, or has everyone else just made new ones?[frame][/frame]

This shows the standard Suzuki mount next to the morris, scarily similar shape when held next to each other. But you can see the difference.


Engine in situ if anyone was interested. Pretty sure nobody has done this before.[frame][/frame][frame][/frame][frame][/frame]

[Suzukimorris]

Excuse the wiring had to open up the loom to see what a series wires I'd left when I did the swap! And yeah that is a Wallace and grommet style bridge from the rad to the engine, was meant to be temporary fix then my mates found it funny so I left it!

[philthehill]

My full race engine puts out in excess of 130bhp at the flywheel and is mounted on standard engine mounts and they have never given any trouble[frame][/frame]

[bmcecosse]

The metal supports will be more than strong enough - if you are concerned about the rubber mounts - drill them and put a bolt right through. I used to do that with Mini rubber mounts to prevent them falling apart when 'stressed' ! Lots of vibration of course!

[Suzukimorris]

Cheers guys 130bhp, how have you gone about that? Is that the bottom of a weber for starts ican see? That's the kind of figures I'm looking at with super charger.

[philthehill]

By putting a lot of time and effort into building the engine. Yes it is a 45DCOE 13 Weber and there are two of them (using all four weber venturi and special Mani-flow inlet manifolds - not Longman split Weber's) breathing through a Manx Racing 940 head modified to give 7 ports.
The figures given for an identical full race engine tested on a dynameter by Manx Racing was 140bhp but I found that the useable rev range 5500 - 10000+rpm was not suitable for speed hill climbing so I have reduced the power to give better lower end. The useable power now comes in at about 3500rpm but I have lost the top end revs but no matter as the rev limiter is set for 7500rpm.[frame][/frame]

[Suzukimorris]

I'd be really interested to see some pics of your motor, as this is the kind of power I'm gonna be playing with would be interested in your feedback re other mods, suspension etc. I'm going mk2 back axle for half shaft strength and diff ratio and then ford discs on the front for pcd match and availability of kits. Are those some strengthening struts from bulk head to front end I can see? Sorry about the interrogation, if your competitive hill climbing my build is for road use so I hope you don't think I'm trying to steal you hard earned knowledge!

Thank you for your time,

Laurie

[philthehill]

Laurie
Happy to share my knowledge.
My Minor has been used on and off in sprints and speed hill-climbs by me since the late 1960s so it has not all come along at once just a general progression of improvements and modifications which is still on-going. The tubes you mention are strengthening struts. I found that because it has a full one piece fibre glass front there was some flexing of the chassis legs and to overcome that I fitted the struts. Helps to keep the front ridged too. As regards the front brakes they are Marina with standard pads. I looked at the Ford conversion and could not see any benefit for me over the Marina ones. The swivels Minor 8cwt van are fitted with Marina stub axles so can use standard Marina wheel bearings. Rear brakes are Wolsey 1500.
Rear axle is 4.55 Minor (about to be changed to 4.8 ) with strengthened half-shafts. Rear springs are Minor traveller with the bottom leaf removed and reset to lower the car 2". Rear dampers are non adjustable telescopic. Anti tramp bars fitted. Whilst I have thought about changing the back axle I have not reached the point where it needs to be changed; I have only had the diff fail on me once in all those standing starts. My philosophy is only change/improve when necessary! Front dampers were uprated levers now adjustable gas Spax. 9/16" anti-roll bar fitted to front. The clutch is a competition Ford RS2000 assy with hydraulic release. Gearbox is a Quaife clubman CR/SC with Quaife alloy housing and quickshift. Mating the gearbox to engine is an improved CS Auto Classics alloy bell housing. Body stripped of all unnecessary metal and full safety cage fitted. Only one seat fitted. Radiator transferred to the boot. 7"x13" dry slicks all round with alloy wheels. Plumbed in fire suppression system. 2" wider fibre glass rear wings. Standard torsion bars fitted but as the front has lost a lot of weight no need to increase torsional strength.
Whilst the suspension does not have all the 'trick' parts the car can be thrown around at will and without loosing control.
As regards the engine - in a nut shell:
Block is 1275cc A plus offset bored to 1380cc. Crank is 1275 Midget cross drilled balanced both static and dynamic (a new all singing and dancing wedged crank is about to be fitted) Steel 4 bolt centre main cap. Camshaft was originally Kent Megadyne 320 scatter (which allows the revs) currently fitted with a 649 but is going to be changed to a 310 scatter which is halfway between the 649 and 320. 1.5 roller rockers. Light steel flywheel. Pistons Omega forged competition. I cannot remember whether the con rods are Cooper S or Midget but they are lightened/polished and balanced. Timing gears are steel vernier duplex. Crankshaft damper is two piece competition. Electronic ignition fitted and of course the Manx Racing 940 - 7 port head with very big valves. To hold it all together ARP bolts are used throughout.
There are numerous other small but not significant modifications incorporated but it would take all night to list them.
I have attached a picture of the car in action at Gurston Down Speed Hillclimb.[frame][/frame]

[irmscher]

Phil very nice engine how much has it cost to get the engine to that spec ???and how competitive is the car

[philthehill]

Lets just say that to build and install the engine and gearbox it was not cheap!
Because the car is/was lumped into the Modified Production Cars 1400cc it is/was up against the likes of Caterham sports cars so there is no way is it going to beat them or win the class but that is not what it is all about. It is the taking part and in a Morris which was and still is the very first car I owned (I have had her for at least 50 years and known her ever since new and used to maintain her before I owned her) as well that generates and maintains the passion for speed hill climbing in me. When returning to the paddock after a run there would always be a good crowd around the car. So in regard to performance it goes quick enough to scare the pants off me at times!!!!!!!!!

[irmscher]

I would estimate around £3000? engine and box am I close great spec

[philthehill]

Nowhere close

[MartinB]

Hi Phil,
Good to see you are still developing and hillclimbing your Morris. The class structure never suits Morris Minors but like you say, that isn't the point!
You might recognise this, at typical run at Gurston in a Morris Minor!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVHaM4YF ... e=youtu.be
(from 2004 before the big wheels and full fat engine went in )

Have you thought about the 16 valve head that the Mini boys are using?

[philthehill]

Martin
Hi
Yes the Minor is still about and still being developed within the MOD Prod regulations. Unfortunately family and work commitments did curtail the hill climbing in recent years but I am now retired and currently re-commissioning her with a view to returning to hill climbing in the near future.
I did consider the KAD 16 valve head with fuel injection but the problem with the Morris as you know is getting the power down as the engine is in front of the pivot point of the front axle and I cannot move it back to get a better weight distribution. I have tried to mitigate the weight problem by moving what I can to the rear but the MSA regulations do not allow me to do much more. Therefore ultimately I considered the 16 valve a unnecessary expense and plumped for the Manx Racing 7 port head instead which gives me plenty of power and provides plenty of interest.
My view regarding the power to expense ratio is coloured by the experience of Carl Talbot who had a KAD 16V head on his minor (180+bhp) and never won anything until he took the engine & transmission and put it in a Lotus 7 and then won the Midlands 1400cc MOD Prod class so an excess of power in a Minor is not always of benefit.
Thank you for the video it brought it all back and stirred the juices!
Phil

[Suzukimorris]

I would estimate around £3000? engine and box am I close great spec

I'm past that and no where near done! Ha ha oh god I feel ill

[philthehill]

I hope that you have deep pockets!!!!!!
Because as I have found over the years modifying/tuning an engine/gearbox (never mind the rest of the car) aint cheap especially if you want it to last and I do all my own engine building and only farm out the machining and yes if I added up the receipts it could give me a heart attack.
Good luck with your conversion.
Phil

[Suzukimorris]

Yeah, I'm farming out the machining and block build, but everything else is being figured out by me, then passed around a few automotive engineering friends, before I do it! I'll open a thread when I start the build, still acquiring bits, but the ultimate goal is to try and figure a multi point injection system, ran on full ecu and supercharged with an overall standard look to scare people who try to cut me up on the lights. I've read canem ecu have solved the Siamese port problem with injection, found a mini moke running it, and read somewhere they had done it and got 40mpg! So it's figuring with oxygen sensors, would it be as simple as just putting the supercharger infront of it and they read the increased amount of air flow.

Who knows, but it should be an interesting read, and can't find a moggy that's documented this yet, so I dare say I'm about to find out why!