Morris Minor Owners Club

I'd just booked my Morris Traveller in for its MOT on Tuesday next week, but today I've found a hole in the floor just behind the drivers seat (pretty close to where the seat rests on the floor... maybe it's having 16 stone of me bouncing up and down as we trundle along).

It's a very small split, a couple of inches long. Metal meets metal, but if you push on it, you can see the split. So what do people think is the best thing to do?

- Buy the rear floor section and replace that? I can't weld, but do have all the kit plus angle grinder (inherited from my Dad) and intend to learn. Is this too advanced for a first job? Is it straightforward with the car on the ground and/or axle stands?

- Patch it, as a first welding attempt? And replace the rear floor section at a later date?

- Get it done by a garage?

I realise that this won't be done by Tuesday, so will cancel my MOT and do without a car for a few weeks.

My plan is to do a 'proper' restoration on the traveller when I finish restoring a 70s VW camper van (just started). I fixed up the wood last year (see my other topic here... http://www.mmoc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=42771) with a view to replacing it in full a couple of years down the line, and the car is pretty tidy and seems solid.

It can be done, while the car is on it's wheels. Take out or cover the seats and carpet etc.

I'd get the area around the split clean down to bare metal. Both sides, inside the car and underneath.

Only replace what is needed. No need for a whole floor, if the whole floor isn't rotten. A lot depends on how much cash you have.

Get some metal from a metal merchant (1mm thick will do), cut out the rot and make a plate the same size as the hole you have.

Either learn to weld and weld it in yourself, or get a garage to do it.

Once welded, paint over the top.

With all the bits, it would only take a weekend.

Thanks Dean... I do have some metal in the garage. I bought my Mum and Dad's house after my Dad died following a motorbike accident, and the garage is how he left it, including the Mig welder, a lot of tools (he worked part time in a motor factors), two project cars, and a load of metal!

That's the decision really. Clean up and patch it to get it through an MOT. Or do it properly. I haven't used a welder since 1987 when Dad and I restored a Morris Traveller together (and I was 16). And I didn't do anything useful then, Dad just let me have a go. I have bought a book about welding recently...

Here's some pics of my floor...



for scale...


from underneath...


The floor doesn't look too clever. Most of it feels solid, so maybe a wire-brush and paint, plus a welded patch, would be fine for now.

Or does it need the whole floor section?

It had this nasty copper paint on that was all peeling off. So I gave it a light scrub with a wooden handled wire brush, and it all came off. That's when I discovered the hole! There's also some kind of patch (top on floor photo) that looks screwed on!?

Oh dear - it looks rotten as a pear...... You may get away with a patch - but I'm guessing it's going to be difficult to get good metal to weld to.. As for screwed on patch.....a no-no if it's within 300mm of suspension mounts/seat belt mounts or seat mounts... But you 'may' get away with it at the MOT - but you should sort it out properly asap...

looks like it needs a good clean with a wire brush attachment on an angle grinder, before you can make a decision

It looks quite rusty, but until cleaned up you don't really know what decent steel you may have.

Sadly cars have a habit of being symmetrical and the same could be going on the other side.

You have two choices.

1) Clean it up and perhaps get away with running around for another year. Then move to choice two

2) Or take it off the road strip it down and do a decent job.

Hmmmm.... Maybe I'll be starting a restoration thread....

Although my wife won't be happy if I do this before the VW camper!

I think it is a weak spot, all the floor flex will meet near the centre and stress, leading to cracks like that.

Sorry but if it were mine I'd bite the bullet and strip the floor back to good clean strong metal. Patching weakens the structure. Fitting a floor repair panel works out cheaper in the long run as you only have to do it once

I took all of the seats and floor carpets out this morning, and gave it all a manual scrub with the wire-brush (don't want to get going with the drill and a wire-brush until I take a bit more out of the car and cover some stuff), and the other side doesn't have a split but is perforated where it meets the back seat box section. It's probably worse than the O/S section. So I'm going to fit two new rear floor sections. Like you say ASL642, it'll work out cheaper in the long run (and be safer).

I'm going to strip all the carpet (on the sills and front wheelarches), remove the kick plate, and check the sills while I'm at it. And double check the front of the floor and the cross-member.

I've got a friend who's a director of an engineering firm and I bumped into him last night. He's got a couple of good welders and thinks one of them would fancy doing the job, and probably at my house with my Dad's MiG. I should be able to learn a bit from him do and do a bunch of the prep and tidying up afterwards myself. I can last a few weeks without the car while we get the floor sorted, but do need to carry on with the VW camper before I consider a full restoration on the Morris.

At least that's the plan.....

I'll take some more photos and start a (rolling) restoration thread!

Thanks everyone for your advice. More will be needed, I'm sure...

Good decision.

Plenty of body resto experts on here to guide you. Only one panel at a time though... easy to get carried away and chop chop chop chop....

Some piccy's of the camper too would be nice..

So my car's been sat in the outbuilding for a few months, getting crapped on by a bunch of baby swallows, with the occasional tootle round the drive. The urgency to sort out the floor was overcome by some silly deadlines and working every weekend (I work from home) and then not needing the car over the kid's summer holiday. But I'm working out of the house one day every week from October and I'll need the Morris to get to the train station.

So last week I found a few hours and started cleaning up the floor. I haven't practiced with my inherited welder yet, and I'm considering taking the car and panels to a very local body shop to make sure I don't make a hash of it. But then I don't know if they'd make a hash of it. So maybe I'll do it myself. With that in mind I'm here for some fairly urgent advice.

Here's some photos....


The front of the floor looks pretty good and seems to have lots of original paint on the driver's side. The problem is the rear quarters, which have been filling with water in heavy rain (before I owned the car it was parked outside and the friend I bought it from complained of damp carpets in the rear). On the driver's side there are two splits. the original one that I noticed that prompted me to start this thread, and then a second, bigger one....



...Cheekily hidden under a screwed on metal patch!! I'm wondering if the small patch is hiding a small hole too.....



The passenger side has lots of the red paint, which makes me wonder if it was pretty rusty and has had this stuff slapped about. It doesn't seem to have helped much in the rear footwells, which are perforated towards the back where the rainwater sat, so I'm hoping the front will be OK once I've finished cleaning it up.



While I was at it, i thought I'd better check the sills. I spent an enjoyable hour trying to undo the rusted up bolts holding the finisher and kick plate in place. A previous owner had also created a jigsaw of shiny metal screwed to the cover plate, so I had fun working out which screws actually went into structural metal. Luckily, not much of it. I'm going to buy some new kick plates!



The good news is that the driver's sill looks pretty good. Looking inside it looks like it's been replaced previously. The car had a lot of work done in the late 80s, so I presume this is from then. There's some surface rust, along with lots of a waxoyl like substance which must've done its job. I'm going to get the other side exposed this week and hopefully it will be solid too.



So, I'm thinking I need two rear floorpans. Unless the front passenger side throws up some invisible horrors as I strip it. I haven't stripped under the car yet either. The underside currently has dry, flaky underseal, which I'm going to remove. But what I've removed so far seems to reveal OK metal or some surface rust.

My questions are:

1. What panels do people recommend? From which of the specialists? Is there a difference in quality (in the steel or fit), between the 'British made' panels? From ESM or Bull Motif, for example? I need to order them this week.

2. What methods do people use for stripping paint/underseal/gunk from the the interior and exterior of the floor? Angle grinder with suitable attachment? Drill with wire-brush? Heat gun and scraper? Combination?

3. This might be clearer when the panels arrive and when the floor's stripped further, but where would I cut to on the rear quarters before fitting new floor pans? (I'll probably ask this again, when I'm done stripping and the panels are here) And what do I need to remove from the car? And how difficult is this job to weld for a beginner? (I will practice on some sheet first)

4. If I want to remove the gearbox cowling (?), do I need to remove all those screws and bolts?!

4. What do people recommend for painting the floor? (interior and exterior)

I think that's it for now. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated! (Also, I have new inertia seat-belts that I meant to fit, so I don't need to save the mountings for the old belts)

I suggest if you want the car for October - you had better enroll the help from the body shop.......... Strip off all you can and then give them the car and the new floor panels - they should do it in a day.......

There isn't that much there...

If you need the car in October... I would cut out the iffy bits an make suitable patches to go in. Patch the same size as the hole (i.e. no overlap)

If your welder works, and you have gas, I will nip over one evening and weld them in for you? If you are quick I could nip over tomorrow eve or Monday/Weds evening next week?

That will get the car on the road and useable ASAP, then plan a suitable time to take it off the road and repair the pans.

I have recently fitted some of the new ESM floor pans (front only atm) and they are a thicker guage steel and fit better than their previous offerings (Which is what I believe the other suppliers still sell)

Hi Matt... That's very kind of you! I actually ordered the floor pans yesterday morning. I used ESM, so that's a relief after your comments on the thicker steel.

So I don't know if it's better to weld them in when they arrive, and wait slightly longer for the car, while I've got seats out and carpets up, and stuff taken off the car. The two splits on the O/S floorpan are where my seat frame bounces on the floor. I'm sixteen stone, so maybe a nice, new floorpan would be the best bet, rather than my seat eventually going through the patches as I tootle down a bumpy Welsh lane.

I'd always be up for a welding tutorial, to get me started. I could come to you sometime, if I'm out of your way. Where in North Wales are you? (When you're not in Southampton!)

I presume my welder works, but it's not been turned on for six years. My dad did a bunch of stuff to my VW camper (sills, wheel arches) just before his motorbike accident, and the welder wasn't that old. It's a Sealey SuperMig, and my dad was using CO2 from a pub, I think. (He worked for a major brewery for many years). There's an older, more knackered looking welder at the back of the garage.

Maybe this kind of thing would be good for a North Wales chapter..? More practical meetings in different members' workshops!

Sealey Supermigs are pretty good

I have a Supermig 170 & a Cebora turbomig 130. The Cebora outclasses the Sealey but its not got as much grunt.

In Trawsfynydd/Porthmadog & have no facilities to do anything up here (im looking for a garage to rent in the area if you know of anything?) - but im not adverse to a bit of a drive in the evening when I have nothing to do &

You need to make the call regarding the floor pans, its not a 2 minute job... Personally (and its just me) I would patch up for October and plan to change them in the summer next year, or at least when you can sort out another vehicle! Properly welded patches are just as strong (possibly more so) as the surrounding metal.

16st? Lightweight

Gaaah... Now I'm not sure. I don't know when the panels will turn up anyway. I'll pm you!

Also, can anyone tell me the best way to clean up under the floor and the interior? Preferred methods? I used a drill with a wire brush and a heatgun on my original Morris years ago, so I've been doing that again. Are there good attachments for an angle grinder to speed it up a bit (without making holes!)

To remove old underseal etc heat it up (blowtorch or wallpaper stripper) and use a scraper to remove

Angle grinder with wire brush is excellent at getting rid of old rust, paint etc and small underseal remenants, showing up any problems BUT WEAR EYE PROTECTION! The wires can break off the brush and fly at speed!

Following on from Matt's post , whilst you should always protect your eyes ( and body generally ) don't forget to cover the interior suitably... so flying metal doesn't embed itself in the glass and interior trim / seats, etc.
When the worst has been removed mechanically, use old rag soaked in white spirit to remove the rest of the underseal.
Bob.

Matt - great offer you are making to help out, but I fear the floor pictures we have been shown suggest to me there is nothing to weld a patch to..... It's all very rusty and I fear it will just run away from you...... It may be difficult to get an MOT-able patch to stick.....