Brake shoe replacement advice

[Windy Pig]

Hey guys,
first of all can I just say how invaluable this little community has been to me, with my first moggie, trying to do as much of the upkeep myself, the forum has been excellent for advice and tips. I will try to contribute some more, as I become more confident with the little beast, I'm finding all sorts of fun stuff.
Anyway, enough gushing, moving on to the question, the little beast has been pulling rather sharply to the left under heavy braking, on the back of a little research and browsing here, set about adjusting the brakes, expecting an offside front problem, but that was alright, so moved rear, and found the offside rear has run out of adjustment, as in, wouldn't lock the drum (I did the near side too, front and rear). I didn't have time that day to get any more done, so popped the wheels back on and off I go. Little beast stopped pulling to the left, for all of about 30 miles. I've got some new shoes, and just wanted to know if there is anything else worth doing while I'm in there with the brakes, and any other things to be careful of, I have a new pair of drums as well, is it worth replacing drums or not?

as I say, you guys have really helped me these last few months, without ever knowing.

[chesney]

If the drums are working leave them alone - there have been plenty of reports of new drums that are of poor quality - warped etcetra. Some red grease on the mating faces of the shoe/cylinder wouldn't go amiss ;)

[daveyl]

It could be the 'triple-sprocket spring' impacting on the 'Clonker-motor'. Also worth checking the 'gangle-pin' for excessive play.

[Windy Pig]

It could be the 'triple-sprocket spring' impacting on the 'Clonker-motor'. Also worth checking the 'gangle-pin' for excessive play.

I hadn't thought of that!

[Windy Pig]

If the drums are working leave them alone - there have been plenty of reports of new drums that are of poor quality - warped etcetra. Some red grease on the mating faces of the shoe/cylinder wouldn't go amiss ;)

cool, I haven't had the drums off, so I don't know the state of the inside, but they don't look great from the outside.

[MarkyB]

They never look much from the outside once they.ve done a few years, it doesn't make any difference to how they work, that's all on the inside.

[Windy Pig]

They never look much from the outside once they.ve done a few years, it doesn't make any difference to how they work, that's all on the inside.

Cool, I won't be able to get to it until Wednesday. I'm guessing as long as the inside faces are not pitted or scratched they are fine?

[bmcecosse]

Pulling to one side ALWAYS indicates a cylinder has failed - either leaking or stuck - on the OTHER side. It's absolutely not anything to do with 'adjustment' . Urgently check the fluid level - and as soon as possible get the drums off to inspect for leaking or stuck cylinders. Pulling to the left indicates a problem on the right side of the car - so start there! But highly likely a good overhaul of the whole system is needed - and it's MOST unlikely it will need new drums.... Shoes and cylinders all round would be a good plan........

[Windy Pig]

Pulling to one side ALWAYS indicates a cylinder has failed - either leaking or stuck - on the OTHER side. It's absolutely not anything to do with 'adjustment' . Urgently check the fluid level - and as soon as possible get the drums off to inspect for leaking or stuck cylinders. Pulling to the left indicates a problem on the right side of the car - so start there! But highly likely a good overhaul of the whole system is needed - and it's MOST unlikely it will need new drums.... Shoes and cylinders all round would be a good plan........

Will do, the shoe is at the end of it's adjustment though, so I will replace both the back ones. Where is a good place to get hold of new cylinders?

[bmcecosse]

Pretty much any of the usual suppliers - best to avoid the 'pattern' front cylinders and pay the bit more for 'original' ones. The pattern rears seem to be ok though. But you can try your local autoparts place - and don't be afraid to ask for a discount. The rear one out of adjustment could be because that brake has been sticking ON and has worn away more than the others. Always slacken back the handbrake cables right off before doing any work on rear brakes.

[Windy Pig]

Ace, I'll get to it Wednesday. thanks.

[Windy Pig]

Right, so an afternoon in the garage, both rear brake shoes were on their last legs, so replaced those, nice and easy, well except for the fact that trying to get the drum holding screw on the near side out stripped the bloody thing. Checked the cylinders, no sign of leaking, or sticking. Took her out for a run and she still pulls to the left.
So, I'm guessing my next step will be suspension and steering linkages, unless someone has a better idea. It does fell like it's pulling rather than weeving.

[David W.]

It's NEVER the gangle pin.

Shoes and drums are never the same radius. Is there a procedure for sanding down the shoes so they fit better, or just wait for them to wear in?

David

[David W.]

Be sure your tyre pressures are correct and consistent. A soft tyre will cause some pulling.

[Windy Pig]

I'm sure someone will tell you I'm wrong, but as far as i know just got to let them bed in.
Tyre pressures are all good. In fact, it was pulling worse before, but i found a nail in offside rear (same one that had a worn out brake pad) had a nail in it, so put 2 new tyres on the back, and that reduced the pulling, but didn't stop it, so i moved on to the brakes. Been really on it with tyre pressures since then.

[bmcecosse]

The pulling is probably from a FRONT brake not working well.....although the rears can give a slight pull, they really do very little braking in normal use. The problem is likely to be in the front right drum - if still pulling to the left. How did you check if the cylinders were not sticking ??

[Windy Pig]

The guys who fitted the tyres for me this morning had it up on the rolling road for me. They said it didn't appear to be sticking. They may well be wrong I suppose.

[linearaudio]

I wouldn't trust any "normal" fitter to determine the interal condition of a 2LS drum set-up!!
Assuming you haven't clumped anything hard enough to bend any steering parts(unlikely), then look closely at the front r/h brake. Can't remember it being mentioned, but have you bled the brakes? If there is a little air in the r/h front pipework, then that could account for an imbalance, as could the flexi-pipe breaking down and expanding with pressure on that side. Other than that it is down to making sure BOTH front r/h cylinders are freely working!

[bmcecosse]

Well indeed if the braking was showing equal on the brake test machine - you DO need to look hard (and urgently) at the front suspension - particularly the tiebar mounts right at the front, then the eyebolts where the lower arm locates to the chassis legs - and at the front damper mounts - and where they attach to the top end of the kingpins......

[Windy Pig]

Right, no, I haven't bled the brakes yet. I've got a brake bleeding kit in the back of the garage somewhere, so I'll do that first thing.
All I've done since i noticed the pulling is check tyre pressures, adjust the brakes, replace the shoes on both rear brakes after finding the offside rear to be out of adjustment and have a look at all of the slave cylinders to see if there are any leaks that are obvious.