Morris Minor Owners Club

I started a thread yesterday in the Modified forum on this board about the article in CCW this week regarding 'road tax issues', but am fast becoming aware that many Minor owners who don't consider themselves in the modified camp can also be affected, so I've posted this here as a 'heads up' to ALL of you. Please read the Modified forum thread http://www.mmoc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=30860 and make sure you're comfortable that it doesn't apply to you. As I've just said in that thread, its perfectly possible that 'post production convertibles' will all get a Q plate at their next MOT's. I'd hazard a guess that there are hundreds of convertible owners about who don't even know their car is a chopped saloon and who are going to get a very nasty surprise when their MOT runs out

Thanks for flagging that up Mike as it seems to be far more complex than first thought.

This seems to be a reissue of the existing rules to MOT stations. The issue of post production convertibles was resolved years ago as the Minor is not a true monocoque.

IMHO this won't affect anyone whose vehicle is exactly as stated on their V5....

bpr81a wrote:This seems to be a reissue of the existing rules to MOT stations. The issue of post production convertibles was resolved years ago as the Minor is not a true monocoque.

I'm not so sure Jon. I mean, yes they are "existing rules" as you state, but they were never previously followed (or if they were, not to this degree). I'm not sure what you mean about a 'true' monocoque, but we don't need to ramble on about that here - whether it is or isn't a monocoque is not the point, what is the point is that the HIVA will not give any consideration to previous agreements and will instead simply make a judgement call on whether they feel it should be classified as such. And as has been said numerous times about that, they wont ask for any consultation with the MMOC or anyone else for that matter, they'll just make a call and whatever they say will be cast in stone from that moment on, without the option to appeal.
The 'it shouldn't affect us' idea is not what we should be passing on, until and unless we get a written letter from someone within the scheme which categorically gives blanket exemption from the points system for post prod convertibles.

Ratbag wrote:IMHO this won't affect anyone whose vehicle is exactly as stated on their V5....

Well I'd hope so, but do you have that direct from someone within HIVA? Obviously this is open to debate, and I don't have a hotline to the right hand of God any more than you do, but I'm quoting direct from the manual on how this scheme is going to be applied.

The Minor IS a true monocoque! It's a 'single shell' - there is no chassis or subframe - it's a one-piece monocoque! The LCVs are a different matter - of course.

Having looked at all the legislation from vosa,I can't see where there is any area of dispute except where a vehicle has been modified or rebuilt using another vehicle as a donor and the owner is applying for the orginal registration number to be retained ,If you allready have a registration document showing the vin number and that coresponds to the registration number \and the number on the vehicle,then as you re mot all the computor does is show that particular vehicle.I suppose that if you had a saloon on mot and then changed it to a convertable for next mot the tester would see that it did not match the previous description and could inform vosa then you may have a problem. But you should of course have informed vosa that you had converted and then the 8 points system would apply and regardless of what you had done to the body then the points would count up 2 for axels 2 for gearbox 2 for suspension 2 for steering and 1 for engine = 9. so no great problem as I see it but have been wrong before so who knows

Rules exist for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men. We're OK so long as there are no fools in charge . I saw the article too and think that for someone to pick holes in a Mini, because it had a Weber (And the bulkhead has been altered a little) is for them to be foolish. Similarly if a car has a five speed box, why should that make it a "Q"? Why should modifying a monocoque be any different to modifying a chassis? You can make a mess of both. Highly modified cars often need engineers reports, in order to get insurance, so I can't see the need for yet more red tape. I think it's just an attempt to dissuade people from modifying cars and FIVA will have no problem with this, as they seem to be against mods (At least unless they are period mods).

On the question of engine swaps.......

DVLA say this

Change to engine and cylinder capacity (engine size)

DVLA will need written evidence of any changes to engine number and cylinder capacity (cc). Written evidence can be:

* a receipt for the replacement engine
* written evidence from the manufacturer
* an inspection report provided for insurance purposes
* written confirmation on headed paper from a garage if the change in engine size took place before you bought the vehicle

So - it seems a 'receipt for the engine' will suffice - doesn't say where that has to come from - so if anyone buys an engine, BE SURE to get a receipt for it! It may be that MMOC will need to get involved- with 'Inspection Reports' provided to owners who are changing engines, EVEN IF the capacity remains unchanged! I'm not saying don't tell DVLA about any engine change - I am saying - be prepared, make sure you have some 'evidence' to support the engine change! Or you may find you can't tax your car, because DVLA have withheld the V5c!! A lad on the Mini Forum reports that after he informed DVLA of an engine change, he got a letter from DVLA telling him he would need to supply evidence, and that his V5c was being withheld. In the same post - was a new V5c with his new engine details added!!!!!!