Morris Minor Owners Club

Hi, as well as my stripped out Moggie, I own a 1984 Nova 1.2 It's in excellent condition and arguably a future classic - no, honest!

Anyway, a few weeks ago it began to have trouble starting and now doesn't start at all. It turns over normally, just doesn't "catch"

I suspected usual things like battery, ignition coil, leads etc. I replaced the leads, spark plugs and etc. There seems to be good spark at each HT lead and coil lead.

Then I thought it might be a fuel problem so dismantled and thoroughly cleaned the carburettor etc but it still won't start checking for any air leaks that might weaken the mixture but all is ok on that front.

The next thing to check will be the fuel pump but has anyone got any other ideas?

Many thanks
Alastair<br><br>

There seems to be good spark at each HT lead and coil lead.

It either has a spark or it doesnt.

Does it have a tradtional ignition system with points or a more modern type with an a electronic module of some sort as I remember years ago a friend having a similar problem with an early Sierra and it turned out to be a module the size of a matchbox on the inner wing.

To start, and engine needs fuel, a spark (at the right time) and compression. I guess you can assume the last of these if it sounds right when trying to start, so it's probably one of the other two.

Are you sure it's a good enough spark? I agree with the possibility of an ignition amplifier fault - quite cheap and easy to change if it is. If you're getting at least a weak spark, then this would tend to indicate that all the Low Tension side is working OK.

Are you sure fuel is getting through OK - are the plugs wet? If you suspect fuel, try using some "Easy Start" or the newly imported from Australia "Start Ya [Don't swear or you will be banned - Admin]" (honestly, it's true, look it up!) - if it coughs or fires a few times on this, it's probably a fuelling problem. Blocked filter? Blocked carb jet?

Only other thing I can think of is valve timing - is this a cam-belt car? Are you sure the belt hasn't snapped? Check the camshaft is going round.... Just thinking about it though, I suspect you wouldn't get a spark at all if the belt has snapped, so this is probably OK.

All the best!

Is the auto choke or whatever cold start device they have on modern cars working?

The early 80's Nova was a great car for it's time. We used them as Pizza delivery cars and they were nearly indestructible despite much abuse.

If you have a good strong spark, then fuel should be easy to check (been there done that recently). Simply pour some fuel into the inlet manifold (somewhere in between a few teaspoons full and half an egg cup full - not that I've ever measured it!).
If it's got compression and a spark, that should make it fire. if it fires then you know you've got a fuel problem.

If you're in a rush and are a smoker, you can spray lighter refill into the manifold - but that's a bit more risky!

If you have a fuel problem, then fuel pump would be the first thing to check. Remove the fuel supply hose and crank the engine - if nothing comes out then there's your answer.

If manual fuelling doesn't make it fire, next thing to check is compression - wierd results could also be cambelt problem (thought 1.2 was chain drive but can't remember after so long)

in the fuel pump there is a rubber bit i have found on the one we had this got damaged and was full of crud so on the fuel pump there is a screw i beleve on the top undo this take top off and clean before u do this take off teh pipe and see if fuel coming out if not there is the problem the pump you can do in situ or undo the 2 pipes and 2 nuts take off and clean easy to do will take about 50 min to do small job hope this helps

Nice! I'm not a huge fan of Novas but to see one of this age so good is a pleasant change.
I think some Vauxhalls of that age had Pierburg carbs. If so, they are a lost cause when they start to go wrong. A replacement one from Weber will cost about 200 notes but is money well spent on a car in that condition.

Oh yes, another thought, The larger engine Cavaliers had crank sensors that go wrong and give similar symptoms.

Peetee wrote:Oh yes, another thought, The larger engine Cavaliers had crank sensors that go wrong and give similar symptoms.

True, but if he's getting any sort of spark, the CAS must be working OK, as on the Cav engines the ignition takes its timing from this sensor.

Cheers!

Could well be the ignition module. My mate had a Nova of similar age and no end of grief til he realised the module was sparking, but randomly. There were, I think, 3 different types, they were NOT cheap, and a rebuilt one from Partco (can't see how they could rebuild one!) went the same way immediately, therefore throwing a red herring at us as we assumed for far too long that the rebuilt unit must, logically be OK! Finally put in a secondhand unit (combined with the distributor) and no more problems. If it is, on the other hand, a carb problem, I would suggest secondhand from scrappy, rather than £200 Weber!!

on the other hand, a carb problem, I would suggest secondhand from scrappy, rather than £200 Weber!!

If it's a Pierburg I would definitely not! Scrappy's would happily sell u one but it would be very unwise to shell out. they are very complicated kit and a nightmare to set up. Labour alone can cost more than a new Weber and the Weber is a doddle to fit. Trust me. I've done this twice on troublesome Polo's and it was absolutely the right thing to do.
- Assuming that is the problem of course

Its been mentioned above a few times and is something I would check as well - the ignition amplifier. I had a similar problem with a Manta years ago, it had a spark but was too weak to start the car, I changed the amplifier and the problem was cured. Otherwise another common fault on the Nova engine was the heat insulated connectors between the HT leads and the plugs (fitted to insulate the heat from the exhaust manifold - generally only on 3 of the 4 plugs) these can break down causing problems.

Novas are great cars almost bought both an SR and GSi many years ago but did have a 1.4i Luxe plus as a run about, it was excellent. Your saloon is very rare now - fantastic boot space for its size.

Wow, I'm very impressed with the level of response so far. Thanks very much. I removed the fuel pump today and noticed that it was very cruddy and the lever (operated by cam in the engine) is a bit stiffer than I think it should be . I will fit a new fuel pump. I will also doublecheck the heat insulators too MGFmad - they looked ok on first inspection but you never know.

The car is indeed in good condition and drives beautifully (when started!). It also has an interesting velour terracotta interior - obviously very chic for 1984? What you can't see from the photo unfortunately is that the thick rigid plastic door moulding is missing from the passenger side - was like that when I bought it. I live in hope that one day, I will find a replacement but they are as rare as clanger droppings...

just a thought if all else is working and you do get a bit of life in the engine and it stops again use a air line and blow down the fuel pipe at the point of supply to pump some time you can get enough fuel to run out but the minute you suck with the pump it can seal over sometimes with rust and muck from the age of the tank or even paint from inside the tank

Hi, well had another go at trying to start the nova - fitted a new fuel pump and checked cambelt and timing - all seem OK so back to square 1. I'm left thinking it is either: still a fuel problem at the carb, a faulty coil or ignition module (even though sparks seem fine when leads etc held against the block)

Still I have cheered myself up this week by welding in a new NS inner wing to my moggie and a repair patch to the offside inner wing. It is almost time for the dreaded chassis legs. My restoration schedule looks like this:

January - chassis legs
February - rear wheel arches
March - engine and gearbox
April - suspension
May to September? - everything else!

May slip a bit but I am determined to try and get her back on the road sometime this year.

Any chance the plug leads may have become mixed up ?? If you suspect the choke etc - Pour some petrol down the carb - then crank it! Alternatively - it may now be hopelessly flooded. In which case remove plugs and either fit another set - or dry out the first set with a gas blow torch. You could also try a tow start ? Sometimes the only way with a badly flooded engine.

Thanks - yes leads are all in correct order - checked and double-checked Spark plugs, distributor cap and ignition and coil leads are all brand new and spark plug gaps are as they should be too.

My next check will be to pour fuel down the carb and double check the hose connections at the choke to make sure no excess air is getting in and weakening the mixture. Other than that I will replace the coil and ignition module and spark plug heatshields as a matter of course although as previously said, sparks seem ok and the shields look OK too.

The strange thing about this is that the car misfired a couple of times when I tried to start it a couple of weeks ago though then ran more or less normally before giving up completely - happily(I guess) on my driveway rather than out in the sticks somehwere!

A real pain but at least I'm spending loads of time on my moggie too!

Are you certain that the cam belt is OK???

The strange thing about this is that the car misfired a couple of times when I tried to start it a couple of weeks ago though then ran more or less normally before giving up completely - happily(I guess) on my driveway rather than out in the sticks somehwere!

My nissan did that when the fuel pump died.

My vectra had a major water leak during the last 1/2 mile of a 100 mile round trip - made it to the driveway.
My S3 Landy broke down when parking infront of my house - at the end of a 1400 mile round trip! (towing the Trabi back to the UK)


It's nice when the cars break down with some consideration!!
My first ever breakdown was in a Minor on a dual carriageway at rush hour in the dark, round a corner!
I had to get under bonnet to see what was what but every 0.5 second had to look back to the road to see if anyone was going to plough into the back of me at 70mph! People were swerving wildly to miss me. Looking under the bonnet got the car fixed (whacked the petrol pump) but my brain was telling me to stand 100 yards away to avoid certain death as it was only a matter of time before a car or lorry failed to react in time.

Are you getting a strong blue spark at the plugs?