Smoke from heater

Post by **Squiggle** » Sat Nov 08, 2008 9:01 am

Hi

I'm trying to finally get focused and sort out my smoke signal that puffs through the left hand dashboard vent [directed up to the windscreen].

Smells acrid. Not steam.

I've been advised to take out the glove box and examine the wires.....which I must get round to doing....

Why does life get in the way...? Where has my confidence to work on my car gone?

But I have a hunch it is the rheostat that's faulty. Wonder if I'll be able to get another or be able to remove and fix this one.

I think the smoke only plumes when the fan is on and the switch seems more 'crunchy' than usual. The switch gets VERY hot after a while with the fan on. The heater itself seems very hot too.

One thing I don't want to accept is that there is a slight water leak from the left [facing the engine] side of the block..... drips down and sits around the bottom of the oil filler tube. A little white trail amongst it too [oil/antifreeze?].

Need to read up on the anatomy of the sidevalve engine to find out what is happening.

So, I'm keeping an eye on radiator levels. It did drop a fair way at one point.

Need to check antifreeze concentration too.

Could the thermostat have failed I wonder. Could the circulating water have got too hot and damaged/affected the heater?

Could we order a week of warm, dry weather to encourage me to go and sort this all out?

Ignoring it all today [coward] and catching the bus.

Regards and

' s to one and all

Post by **bmcecosse** » Sat Nov 08, 2008 9:47 am

Well the water leak will likely need a head gasket change - eventually. Get one in stock - and just keep an eye on the leak meantime. The smell will be the rheostat - just cahnge it for a switch - you will want the heater full blast during winter anyway!

Post by **Squiggle** » Sat Nov 08, 2008 10:10 am

bmcecosse wrote:Well the water leak will likely need a head gasket change - eventually. Get one in stock - and just keep an eye on the leak meantime. The smell will be the rheostat - just cahnge it for a switch - you will want the heater full blast during winter anyway!

You have no idea how much you've cheered me up!

Changing the rheostat sounds more straight forward than searching for burnt wires. I'm even less confident with electrics. I never know how much to worry ie how far a plume of smoke is from full blown fire.

I'm not surprised you say head gasket.....bit of blue rubbery material was hanging down from the leaking area. I have a spare gasket set somewhere too.

Thanks

Post by **mike.perry** » Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:34 pm

Check your spare head gasket, there are a lot of rubbish MM gaskets around. A good gasket should be sealed around the combustion chambers, all the water passages and the outside. If it is not then the chances are that the water will leak through the gasket. I know, I've been there.
As for the heater smoke, first run the heater and turn the rheostat switch all the way round in a clockwise direction. It should start in the off position, then max speed and slow down to almost stop. If it does that then there is probably not much wrong with the switch. If it does not operate smoothly then you can gently take the switch apart by undoing the tags and then clean the windings with a piece of emery.
To get at the switch you will have to undo the screws holding the heater to the parcel shelf and underneath the switch panel and also undo the screws at either end of the parcel shelf to give some room. Pull the demister pipe connection off the top of the heater, then undo the spring clips holding the front on. Spin the blades by hand to check if the blades are spinning freely. If not then the motor is possibly siezed. Have a sniff to see if there is any smell of burning. If you disconnect any wires, remember where they go, it can get confusing. Try to remove the heater without disturbing the pipes or you will get a footwell full of water.

Post by **Squiggle** » Sat Nov 08, 2008 6:25 pm

mike.perry wrote:Check your spare head gasket, there are a lot of rubbish MM gaskets around A good gasket should be sealed around the combustion chambers, all the water passages and the outside. If it is not then the chances are that the water will leak past the gasket. I know, I've been there.
As for the heater smoke, first run the heater and turn the rheostat switch all the way round in a clockwise direction. It should start in the off position, then max speed and slow down to almost stop. If it does that then there is probably not much wrong with the switch. If it does not operate smoothly then you can gently take the switch apart and clean the windings with a piece of emery.
If you are still getting problems then undo the spring clips holding the front on and then spin the blades by hand to check if the blades are spinning freely. If not then the motor is possibly siezed. Have a sniff to see if there is any smell of burning. Whilst the front is off you can remove the switch.
If you have to remove the heater it is easier to undo the screws at the ends of the parcel shelf to give more room. If you disconnect any wires, remember where they go, it can get confusing. Try to remove the heater without disturbing the pipes or you will get a footwell full of water.

Ok Mike, thanks, I will have a good look tomorrow. I was hoping I could investigate without removing the heater after watching the super team install it. I'll never stop being grateful to the MM Rally team who spent time installing it.

One question, is it safe to drive it? Could it catch fire?

OK all of you who are collapsed in giggles.......stopppit !

Post by **bigginger** » Sat Nov 08, 2008 6:39 pm

??? Why would anyone be laughing? Short answer, I'm afraid, is that if it's smoking yes, it could catch fire. Can you isolate it at all to make it temporarily safe?

Post by **mike.perry** » Sat Nov 08, 2008 11:46 pm

If you don't use the heater then there should be no problem. If there is still smoke when the heater is turned off then the problem is elsewhere. You could have a wire shorting out under the dash. I have edited my instructions so please read them again

Post by **Squiggle** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:49 am

Many thanks guys. And that includes Cam who is always on the end of the phone with advice when I get in a Mogpickle. Lucky me.

Sounds like I should remove the passenger seat???

The rheostat does what Mike describes it should. Start, blow, slow down.
Can hear the fan, I wonder if that means blades are not jammed.

That reminds me of my ol' traveller. The fan was loud so you thought you were getting warmer...... but actually no heat was offered.

Post by **bigginger** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 3:21 pm

mike.perry wrote:If you don't use the heater then there should be no problem.

Not necessarily true, I don't think. Depends what side of the switch the short is

Post by **mike.perry** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 5:23 pm

I can't think of anything on an MM that is wired on the left side of the parcel shelf area unless you have any accessories. You may have to take the glove box out to have a look.
That's the parcel shelf out, the heater out, the passenger seat out, the glove box out. What else can we take out whilst we are here????

Post by **bigginger** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 6:03 pm

Does the (I don't have a clue about MMs) wiper motor wiring pass through there?

Post by **Onne** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 6:09 pm

That is on the other side...

Post by **bigginger** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:00 pm

Really? Must have a look at one

Post by **mike.perry** » Sun Nov 09, 2008 11:06 pm

You don't want to be fiddling around with the wiper motor, that is buried behind the instruments on the right and is a pig to get at. The wiper switch is by the windscreen centre pillar and I think it connects into the heater wiring somewhere.
Unfortunately as the heater is an aftermarket fit there is no wiring diagram in the manual so it was up to the fitter how it was wired up

Post by **RogerRust** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:44 pm

Good news.

I couldn't see any problem with the wiring.
The fan motor runs nicely at 1.5 amps and is connected to the correct side of the auxiliaries fuse.

None of the wires look fried under the dash.

Two things

1) it is probably best to run the fan at the high setting rather than with the knob turned round to the slow position because when the fan is running slow the energy is being dissipated in the variable resistor which will get hot. So either best to run with the fan going fast or with the fan off.

2.) there was a little bit of moisture behind the dash so perhaps the heater is leaking a bit and the smell was caused by a bit of water in the fan motor.

If it was my car from my investigation today I would get on and use it. However to be on the safe side I fitted a quick release connection at the fuse box so that the fan circuit could be isolated in a hurry!!

Post by **mike.perry** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:38 pm

There is no point in running the heater at anything other than full speed, there is not enough output to need to turn the heater down.

Post by **alex_holden** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:38 pm

If the rheostat is knackered, I think I have a spare one...

Post by **alex_holden** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:41 pm

mike.perry wrote:There is no point in running the heater at anything other than full speed, there is not enough output to need to turn the heater down.

Unless it's sub-zero outside I find it very handy to be able to turn the speed down once the cabin has warmed up. Sometimes I wish it would go even lower, because I end up alternating between 'off' and 'minimum' to keep the cabin at a comfortable temperature.