Morris Minor Owners Club

Hi everyone,

Before I start any job I always come here nowadays, sometimes the manual is like a different language to me. I am currently experiencing vibrations when I slow the car down through the gears. I have checked the universal joints on the prop shaft then they seem good (and the noise doesn't occur when accelerating) so I am suspecting the engine and gearbox mounts are old and a bit soft. I am thinking the easiest way to replace them is to undo the bolts and try and lift the engine and box up a little using a trolley jack, and then replace one mounting at a time.

Has anyone done this and is there enough room to raise the gearbox like this? I am hoping to take my car to this years M.O.T. in France, so I want to eliminate this problem in case it turns out to be something bigger.

Thank you - Graham

There's just about room to lift the engine/change the mounts that way, but it's still very tight, plus jacking under the sump is less that advisable, really. Possible with a plank to spread the load a bit, but you run the risk of bending the sump even then. I've also not tried it with prop and box still connected, and imagine that so doing would leave the heater tap open to damage by the bulkhead as you lift.

Thanks bigginger,

Ok, I will probably drain the coolant and remove the heater valve, (has been off a few times doe to the old one not working and the replacement not being very good) and well take it very slowly. Good idea about a plank to spread the load, maybe try use two jacks so all the weight isn't on the sump. Hopefully it wont end up being one of those getting it all halfway there and finding it doesn't work kind of jobs - thus the question. Will let you know how I get on.

Otherwise the correct way to do it is to split the engine and gearbox I take it - not so much fun, and then use a hoist. I am waiting for the clutch to finally give up before I attempt that job.

Thanks for the advice.

For me, easiest to remove engine and box together, and split them out of the car

Just pop the engine out for clutch job. You should manage the gearbox mounts ok (engine mounts dead easy) - but you may find you need to drop the gearbox cross member which is also easy enough PROVIDED the caged nuts are still caged ! Test them carefully first. If they spin you will have to take the gearbox cover off - a messy job at best.

You will find that it is nigh on impossible to change the engine mounts
unless you release one of the mounting towers from the chassis too.
It is NOT easy to lever the new rubbers into position otherwise without damage. There are many reports that fitting new pattern rubbers has actually made the vibrations worse. Do not throw away your old ones until you are satisfied! You should check that the steady wire on the bottom of the gearbox to chassis cross member is in position and is adjusted correctly.

Yes - I agree - the tower bolts will need to be undone for front mounts, only one to do both mounts - but still easy enough to do, it's only 4 (slightly awkward) bolts! The 'vibrations' may be from the back axle - are the springs ok(no broken leaves), and the spring shackle rubbers - and the brackets that locate the springs to the axle are they ok ? Some recently have reported these brackets rotting away and allowing the axle to twist on the springs.

BMC I think you should consider your remarks more carefully before you post them. With reference to the front engine mounts you posted
'dead easy'. This is certainly not the case unless you remove one of the front mounting towers too which a novice would not know resulting in
a terrible tussle without removing one. You are experienced, most of the
people on here are not. Try to go back to your novice days when posting
advice. You have a wealth of experience which is invaluable, but only if you assume that you are talking to a 'novice'.

It's still 'dead easy' - certainly not an engine out job! It's only 4 bolts to pop a tower - even when I had my first Minor at age 17 I could figure that out! It really is one of the easy jobs on a Minor - however the gearbox mounts are another matter alltogether!

GRAHMO - Firstly, when working under the car, ensure your safety. Use axle stands or ramps, and chock the wheels on the groound. Do NOT rely on only jacks to support the car.

Secondly, the basic concepts are simple, and well within DIY capability, but there can be problems. Don't be disheartened, just methodical. The problem is usually with old bolts and nuts that are corroded and seized, or that are covered in old oil and road dirt so that you can't see them. Wash everything with degreaser (I recommend Jizer) then coat with penetrating oil (Plusgas) and leave to soak well in. Good fitting correct size sockets and open ended spanners will be required, although mole grips can also be invaluable.

If you're going to lift the engine then definitely remove the heater tap and disconnect the top steady bracket (back of engine to just below battery box). It's also best to drain the radiator and remove the hoses rather than stretching them.

Definitely release one of the front mounting towers from the body (4 bolts in total). The inside bolts are on the inside edge of the chassis leg, the front right in the corner with the front cross member. One of the outer two bolts is just above the tie rod bushes and must be inserted with the nut upwards so that it doesn't foul the bush.

When refitting, assembly everything loosely, lower the engine to almost its normal position, then refit the tower securely to the car - you may need to use a thin screwdriver or similar lever to get the bolt holes lined up. Lastly, remove the jacks and then tighten the nuts on the rubber mounts. ie, tighten the mounts when they are loaded with the weight of the engine.

For the gearbox, I'm not aware of any method other than removing the cross member. Remember to support the box on a jack first - support, not lift. As noted by others, the bolts are held by captive nuts inside the chassis leg. If the nut starts to turn then you will have to remove the gearbox cover - to do this, it's easiest to first remove the seats! There are numerous brass cross-head screws holding the cover to the rest of the floor. Clean the heads out so that the screwdriver can get a good grip. It's not unknown for the threads to seize and the heads to shear off. One or two - not a problem. More than that, drill out the old bits , re-tap thread, and fit new bolts when reassembling. The cover has to be fitted securely (a) to stop fumes coming into the cabin and (b) to help prevent flexing of the body (some may argue with this, but it's my experience).

You may find that in order to gain access to the nuts on the gearbox mountings, it's actually easier to take the floor cover out anyway!

When moving the cross member be careful of the routing of the fuel pipe, brake pipe, and electrical wiring.

Good luvk !

simmitc wrote:For the gearbox, I'm not aware of any method other than removing the cross member.

As I've often said, it's removable (on an LCV anyway) still connected to the engine WITHOUT removing the X member. Need to remove the gearbox cover though
a

I'd had a long day last night (if that makes sense) but Andrew's quite right in that with the cover removed, you can get to the gearbox mounts, which is what I meant to be writing about.

GRAHMO - the other thing to be wary of is that if the cage nuts for the cross member mounting bolts start moving on the driver's side then you'll most likely have to remove the brake master cylinder to fix the problem, so it might be better to start out by taking the cover off.

I would inspect the engine mounts -and if broken try replacing them first before going anywhere near the gearbox mounts!

Thanks for all the help. The problem was surprising easy, I replaced the rear springs two years ago, and the rubber bushes under the U bolts had perished a little making the nuts loose, not falling off, but the needed half a turn. Tightened them up and hey presto, noise has all but gone (well its about the same as I am used to). I ordered both engine mounts and gearbox ones, so I will definitely replace the engine ones as it doesn't sound like too much of a job. The gearbox may have to wait until I do the clutch. But without your help in knowing what to look I wouldn't know where to start - just goes to show you need to check all the simple things before going in too deep with major jobs!

Still the I reckon engine mounts are going to be quite painless (the are old and look rather soft) now I know how to do it.

Thanks again!

I Repeat, don't throw the old 'soft'ones away.

Update - well some time has passed and the problem reappeared. I changed the gearbox mounts (as they looked in the worst condition), it wasn't too much hassle in the end, I simply dropped the cross member (keeping the box supported on a jack) and managed to drop the old ones out and pop the new ones in. The only issue I had was it didn't align properly and I ended up having to take the cover out to get the last bolt in... annoying and very time consuming.

The gear change fantastic, but the noise was still there. Anyway it turns out behind where the prop shaft joins the diff, there is a big nut and washer. The washer had broken up, causing the nut to work loose. So when I lifted off the power whole shaft moved in and out! One new washer and oil seal later and the car is much happier.

I might still change the engine mounts, but seeing as the car is running nearly silently that job can wait. I'll keep the old gearbox mounting 'just in case' (mainly because I can't seem to throw anything away). Anyway it just goes to show vibration problems are never where you think they are going to be!

Thanks again for all your assistance, am looking forward to the National this weekend - hope the weather holds out!

Well done Grahmo, glad you got it sorted. Be sure and pop by for a cuppa down on branch avenue.

Great stuff Graham you are now a fully paid up member of Willies `Think Simple First Club`.
Its all to easy to get carried away not that I ever do, well not more than once a month anyway

Good result. the pinion nut should be tightened to a torque of 140 ft lbs.
I have never understood why it doesn't have a locking plate on it.

Well found - and well done getting that sorted. Point for us all to note for the future.