Unleaded head....is it worth it?

Post by **youngun** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 6:58 pm

Ive been looking at the unleaded heads available from Bull motif and ESM.
Are they worth getting or is it just as good/cheaper to run around using Valvemaster....i will be using my car as an everyday car.

YG

Post by **chickenjohn** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:14 pm

Don't worry about it- my Traveller has been fine for years and I don;t use additives and the head is original. Just drive the car sensibly (don't thrash it and it will be fine). I do tend to use Sainsburys LRP, the car runs well on that.

Post by **MoggyTech** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:15 pm

Really depends on a bit of luck. Valve seats do have some 'memory' effect, which combined with a lead additive/alternative should be fine. I would do a compression test to get a general idea of the engine and valves health. If it's ok leave well alone, and consider an unleaded head when an engine rebuild is on the cards.

Post by **Orkney** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:18 pm

Castrol Valvemaster A 250ml bottle treats 250 litres fuel (c.2.5p per litre)

Castrol Valvemaster Plus Octane Boost A 250ml bottle treats 250 litres fuel (c.4p per litre). Includes an octane booster to raise the octane rating from 95 ron to 97 ron.

matter of sums depending on your miles maybe - whats the cost of an UL head & fitting if your not doing it yourself?

CJ how much more is the LRP petrol than standard?

Post by **Kevin** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:53 pm

Also remember that valve seat resession doesnt really occur until constantly driving at over 50mph, generally its not worth doing unless you are having some head work done anyway.

Post by **youngun** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 8:07 pm

Well, i would say that with the Mg cam, Howley manifold, HS4 carb etc....its unlikely i will be pootling round!
Plus the engine is in bits now, so do i go for one or not?

YG

Post by **bmcecosse** » Mon Sep 10, 2007 8:39 pm

Don't bother! Just run the car nd keep an eye on the exhaust valve clearances. Run them at 15 thou - and just check from time to time. I don't use any additive - just normal unleaded. If you see the gaps start to close up - then it's time to consider an additive - or better still - get hold of a 12G940 head , sink the valves into the head by 40 thou - and use that! If you really MUST use an additive the only one that contains lead (tetra-ethyl-lead) is TETRABOOST. If you use that you will exactly replicate the old leaded fuel. All other additives are mixtures of various sodium and potassium compounds - and some have definite bad press for effectiveness! Yes there were trials carried out - but did they in any way replicate real life motoring ? I don't think so. With Tetraboost you can't go wrong - but don't let it anywhere near a catalytic converter.

Post by **Pyoor_Kate** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:30 am

As others have said it depends on what you're going to do with it; and also how tedious you find using additive.

Locally, Valvemaster now sells for 10 quid a bottle; and I've not seen anywhere cheaper for a while. So if you do a lot of miles (like I do), then an unleaded head is probably worthwhile (I also do most of my miles on the motorway, well above 50). If you are occasionally thrapping the engine, but most of the time you're trundling round town, then it may not be worth it - so long as you keep an eye on your valve clearances.

It basically is a ymmv situation

Post by **bmcecosse** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:48 am

An 'unleaded' head is said to take about 10,000 miles to pay for itself - so yes - if doing high mileage and Mway then it is probably the way to go. But often 12G940 unleaded heads go on ebay for about £40. So that way - huge performance improvement and unleaded for not much cash!

Post by **dunketh** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:02 am

I'm just going to run mine til they burn themselves out. After that time I'll fit another 2nd hand cheap head and do the same.

If I do stumble across an unleaded one cheap I'll fit it. Trouble is folk want 'real' money for em - even 2nd hand.

Post by **Orkney** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:10 am

Locally, Valvemaster now sells for 10 quid a bottle; and I've not seen anywhere cheaper for a while.

£6.99 here (or 5.99 if you buy 5) - or £11.99 for the octane boost version

http://www.triumphshop.co.uk/Quiller/Un ... master.htm

I'm not mean just careful

Post by **Pyoor_Kate** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 10:30 am

Fair enough; it's also a convenience thing - and a not leaking on the inside of my car thing. I've had some valvemaster leaking before and it's not particularly pleasant.

But mainly I get fed up of having to faff about opening the boot and adding additive every time I fill up. I resent filling up anyway, it gets in the way of me getting home, or to work, so it's a big laziness issue on my part

Post by **DanRodd** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 2:03 pm

Yes,just carry on using it,so long as you dont thrash it and do high mileage towing for instance there shouldnt be a problem.I have just fitted a Bull Motif unleaded head to mine,but that was simply because it was easier than getting snapped studs out of the thermostat area,the thermostat srill beiong "welded" in now!i also had a slight weep at the back so it needed to come off at some point for that so it was easier to get a new head.Be warned tho,unless you like getting old studs etc out the old one there is quite a lot of things to buy in addition,i had to get:thermostat studs,manifold studs,heater tap studs,obviously gaskets,rocker assy studs, and the new heads dont come with valve collet circlips either!

Post by **overider** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:15 pm

Hi I use millers VSP Plus and I thought it was the bees knees but the Quillers is much cheaper, might give it a go, I think its not a good idea to mix them so I will run the tank with millers out and run a bit without any additive then try the Quillers

The link for millers is

http://www.millersoils.net/1_Millers_frame_CLASSIC.htm

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:49 pm

Aye - but it's not got LEAD in it!!

Post by **overider** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 10:54 pm

the VSP data shet says:- DESCRIPTION:
* Lead Substitute and Octane Improver.
* Specially developed fuel treatment based on Manganese chemistry.
* Endorsed by the FBHVC for valve seat recession protection.

might not have lead in it but its a lead substitute, Is this not a safer option?

Post by **southerly95** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 11:13 pm

I changed my cyl head 6 months ago and havn't looked back. Fuel consumption is a lot better, SWMBO doesn't have to muck about with additives and the car goes very well on it - as would any new head after running in of course. Good luck, John

Post by **bmcecosse** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:53 am

Hmmm - manganese chemistry indeed!! Not heard of that before. I do see that it can be used as an Octane booster (no mention of seat protection!) - however Mn is toxic and linked to impaired motor skills in children and there are suggestions exposure can lead to increased risk of Parkinsons in later life!

Post by **overider** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:11 pm

You are scaring me now bmc

Post by **overider** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:18 pm

bmcecosse wrote:Hmmm - (no mention of seat protection!)

* Endorsed by the FBHVC for valve seat recession protection.
* Increases the octane of the fuel by 2 octane number (20 points).
* Improves combustion process by controlling propagation of flame front resulting in reduced risk of detonation and smoother engine running.
* Can be used with complete safety in turbocharged engines.
* Does not contribute to valve stick even at double treatment.
* Will not increase engine wear or produce any adverse engine deposits.* No ignition adjustments necessary.* Will mix safely with LRP leaded petrol and other additives containing potassium or phosphorus.

PERFORMANCE PROFILE:
* FBHVC endorsed. Extensive test bed and road evaluation in wide range of engine types. Confirming excellent valve seat recession protection when using unleaded petrol.
* Increased concentrations of 1 bottle to 20 litres of fuel can be used in safety for high speed running.