Morris Minor Owners Club

Guys - today, I ripped off the rear drums of the 1960 2-door. I found that the drums are in relatively bad shape (rust pitted, and one drum is very worn... and the M/C is stuck. Normal pedal movement, but it just doesn´t go into the M/C...maybe its first chamber is totally rusted or the brake pedal actuator/pin is rusted to the cylinder entrance?

But: both hand brake wires do their job (the return is sloppy, but still). The linkage from the wire to the brake lining seems to work, sort of, on both wheels. On the right side, the lower lining is so worn that not even a "full right" adjustment will lock the wheel on the parking brake.

So, after whipping the drums with a rotating paint stripper and heating/lubing all linkages, plus loosening both bleeders I have ONE parking brake lining that works. But: that´s all mechanical, right? No hydraulics involved.

The brake cylinders themselves look fairly new, but do not budge when I try to press them together. Well, one of them actually bleeds a bit of brake liquid from the opened bleeder valve, but I can´t get any sustainable or repeatable action from it....

No reaction from rear cylinders when I try to blow compressed air into the bleeder valve..and nada when pressing the brake pedal...I guess they´re both seized, too.

So..tomorrow is front brake time.

I need your help. What to do next? I´m going to make an inventory of the front brake status tomorrow, lubing, heating and wiggling things, see what can be re-used.

Should I rip out the M/C to see if I can force it to work? Pressing the pin into it while using a bench vise?

Or should I forget troubleshooting and just order new parts?

Dang, I´m tired. Brain malfunction - please help me think?

Cheers /Richard

Edit: one shot of Glenfiddich later: Could I rip out a fresh front lining (if any) and use it on the rear in order to get a parking brake on the rear right (which is badly worn)? I looked to reverse/invert the rear linings, but only the lower one has the adjuster cutout...

This made me think....both linings on the front wheels have adjusters=adjuster slots in the linings....so it should be possible to move a front lining to the rear in order to at least get a fully working parking brake(which is all I need for now)?

Single circuit brakes, and it's sounds like yours are pretty bad. My advice regarding brakes, is NEVER take any chances if they are that bad. Renew the lot for piece of mind and safety. Remember to test/check every pipe and flexi hose. If all you need is a parking brake, a couple of bricks to chock the wheels will do just fine.

Well, bricks don´t help when driving in an up/downhill garage driveway - that´s what I need the parking brake for . Being able to move the car inside the garage out on the street now and then is important, the P/B being better than nada while I repair the main brake system. (The car is not being used in traffic until everything is proper.)

So: can I swap a good front lining with a bad lower rear lining?
Can I expect more handbrake if I do?

And what would you do with the M/C once it is out of the car? What method would you use to try and revive it?

Edit: one more point: one of the rubber bumpers between the rear axle and the body has come loose. The rubber part just fell off..it´s the older flatter version. Can it be glued/vulcanized back onto whatever it is mounted on (some kind of metal sleeve that is bolted to the axle), or do I need a replacement?

Keep ´em comin´ , folks. I need your input.

Cheers /Richard

yes the brake shoes from the front can go on the rear to get you with a parking brake. as far as the master cylinder is concerned its about 100% certanty to be unservicable.After a long lay up or after years of use the water content in the brake fluid rusts the bottom of the bore in the cylinder. Even if you get it apart,and clean it out ,the roughness left by the rust will simply and quickly damage the any new seals of a repair kit.Tried it and learned the hard way. Replace the m/c .Thats the most expensive bit. The front wheel cylinder are very cheap,as are brake drums.Been down the route of stripping and cleaning many times .in the end you just start chasing your tail,renew as much as you can afford right from the start,better and SAFERin the long run,cheers

If any use... ive just replaced all of mine right through - the linings wernt too bad at all - they just never worked because of the seized cylinders - if you want any of the bits that came off your welcome and could post them monday if it will get you out of a spot till you do them properly.
have
2 pair front 8" shoes
2 pair rear 7" shoes
'think' one of the rear cylinders migth be functional but thats not a concern if your just using the cable.
pair 8" front drums very poor condition
1x 7" rear drum poor condition
1 x 7" rear drum as good as new - the fool who worked on the car previous replaced one only on the back to a seized cylinder which they never fixed - so it and the shoes from that side have never been worn at all.

As i said might get you out of a spot - let me know - the airmail shouldnt be too bad even if you wanted the good drum
Cheers
Kevin

You need to decide if you are staying with 7" front drums - it would be far better to go up to the later 8" drums - and since you really DO need to replace EVERYTHING - there's no point spending money on the 7" fronts if you are not keeping them. The m/c will be ruined- get a new one - and ALL new kunifer pipes - and ALL new flexi pipes - and new slave cylinders all round and new front shoes. You can probably salvage enough old shoes to use on the rear - but is it really worth it? And yes - get two new rear bump stops - and look to see if the front ones are still there - you need all 4 bump stops in good condition. Almost ceratinly you will need a whole new set of rubber bushings for the suspension - both front and rear - it's up to you if you go polyurethane - or stick with rubber. Most go poly - but it does cost a bit more.

Kenatt: Thanks, your tip saved my day, I now have a handbrake.

Orkney - that´s a most generous offer! I will have to think and do some online research for a day or so, and will PM you when I figured things out. Meanwhile - THANKS!

Bmcecosse - you really cheered me up there - talk about drilling a major hole in my wallet! In any case, I have actually come to some conclusion (which agrees with you!) to replace the lot. The M/C isn´t all that bad internally, but I wont take any chances. Remains to see which supplier will get my business. Tomorrow will show.

Most of the brake tubing has been replaced back in -91, it´s new and still shiny tubing. Brake cylinders are renewed at that time too, but can probably not be trusted. The hoses are original and need to go. 3 drums are OK. All linings except one are OK (as new).

So...some waiting for parts time ahead. Dang - I missed to measure the brake diameter. Is it the inner diameter (where the action takes place)that is 7" or 8" respectively?

Details on the rust attacks I found today can be found in the Bodywork forum....where I will continue to pester you all for advice...

Thanks, all. You´re a good bunch. Cheers /Richard

Yes - measure the drum diameter - the rears will be 7" - fronts may be 7" or 8". Are there no parts suppliers in Sweden ?

Parts suppliers in Sweden will be checked for tomorrow and Monday - although I fear these old junkers won´t have much support here anymore. Hopefully I am wrong. Problem is that IF there are suppliers, they will most certainly rip me off. The UK is a totally different market, with loads of old BMC et al cars still rolling.

/R

Indeed - and the cost of Minor parts here is very low compared to rip-off prices for modern car parts. Try Bull Motif - they do a 'no carriage charge' deal if you buy enough parts - probably not to Sweden - but something could be arranged, I'm sure. There must be MG and Triumph parts suppliers in Sweden - maybe try them ?

Bluesman wrote:these old junkers won´t have much support here

Bluesman wrote:Parts suppliers in Sweden will be checked for tomorrow and Monday - although I fear these old junkers won´t have much support here anymore. Hopefully I am wrong. Problem is that IF there are suppliers, they will most certainly rip me off. The UK is a totally different market, with loads of old BMC et al cars still rolling.
/R

For various reasons (that are too complicated to go into) I have to move a 71/2 ton truck full of stuff from oxon to Copenhagen in the near future if you need any big bits then please let me know and i'll bring them over for you.

As far as the brakes go .. replacing all the brake together is a good move .. as i said before I would suggest new suspension bushes at the same time ..

Just to get the parking brake working there is no reason why you shouldn't "Break" the seisure to make the parkign brake work. A couple of strokes of grease in the two tubes might help ..

If you need things like drums then there are new ones about but I've got several second hand ones that should be fine if you need them ..

There's a good deal that's going to be hard to beat!!

JustinMinor - PM on the way.

Well, I swapped all cylinders for new ones, and replaced the M/C plus a few brake lines. Drums and all linings were ok-ish, and drums and linings can/will be swapped later. Looks like we´re having some brakes at least. I am leaving the car overnight to bleed itself after we did the initial work. Brakes, OK handbrake, but weak pedal so far. It will be worked out tomorrow. In any case, consider it fixed for now. Thanks to all!

/Richard

Well done. Do you have an annual safety inspection for cars in Sweden ??

Yes. every 2 years for veterans like this (30+ years old).

This car hasn´t had one since 1991 - it has been garaged since.

Cheers /R

So - it now has to go through an inspection - is it strict ?

Strict? Ah well, yes. The will poke around for rust with a sharp pointed small hammer, they will try to kill the brakelines with a knife, they will force the suspension and front wheel assembly to work hard with this vibrator thing while watching the ball ends...and they will test the brakes etc etc.
Lately, they have been more into roadworthyness and safety than in previous years. It´s absolutely useless to go there unless you have a basically sound car to show.

Still, I guess they will be a bit more forgiving when it comes to a low-powered 1960 model classic small car than a 1995 SUV.

And they have classic car enthousiasts working there, which is actually both good and bad. They DO find the weak points since they KNOW them, and they DO let people off the hook out of sympathy sometimes. I actually appreciate if they find stuff and tell me to fix it - before I find out myself, on the road - even if it is a sour grape to chew on just then and there.

Cheers /Richard