1098 cc getting more difficult to start from cold

[les]

Boiling water poured over corroded battery terminals neutralises any corrosion instantly. This is a time honoured process and it works very well.

Tell the kids that nowadays and they wouldn’t believe you.

[svenedin]

A quick video I made about use of the choke for anybody unfamiliar with it

Stephen

https://youtu.be/ExAX_nMNn50

[geoberni]

Boiling water poured over corroded battery terminals neutralises any corrosion instantly. This is a time honoured process and it works very well.
It only gets rid of the corrosion, it does not add power to the battery.

Yes, as advised to me by an old-time mechanic many years ago. I have done it in the past, though not on my current car, because it has never suffered from furred-up battery terminals......

Sensible maintenance prevents a lot of these problems.
I've never had furry battery posts on a vehicle in 50+ years of ownership, because I always grease them; with petroleum jelly (aka Vaseline) in the old days, more recently a spray of white grease.

As I was out in the garage earlier, it only took me a minute or so to crank Basil over with the Ign off and check the voltages and current.
Results were in the region I expected.

Battery Terminal Voltage 12.5v
When cranking a steady 123 Amps
Terminal Voltage dropped to steady 10.4v

[svenedin]

I use this which is a nice red colour making it obvious. Also on solenoid connections. https://www.liqui-moly.com/en/gb/batter ... l1cGR#3140

Durite sell a similar product.


Stephen

[geoberni]

I use this which is a nice red colour making it obvious. Also on solenoid connections. https://www.liqui-moly.com/en/gb/batter ... l1cGR#3140

Durite sell a similar product.


Stephen

Being a bit of a pedant, I wasn't impressed by the line on that listing which said...

very compatible with plastics

Where does being just regularly 'compatible' lie in the great list of potential compatibles ?
What makes it 'very'?
What other adjective (or adverb) can be used...why isn't it greatly compatible, supremely compatible...

I think I need to lie down...

[svenedin]

I use this which is a nice red colour making it obvious. Also on solenoid connections. https://www.liqui-moly.com/en/gb/batter ... l1cGR#3140

Durite sell a similar product.


Stephen

Being a bit of a pedant, I wasn't impressed by the line on that listing which said...

very compatible with plastics

Where does being just regularly 'compatible' lie in the great list of potential compatibles ?
What makes it 'very'?
What other adjective (or adverb) can be used...why isn't it greatly compatible, supremely compatible...

I think I need to lie down...

It's a German company so I suspect the nuances and subtleties of English are lost in translation......

Stephen

[Chief]

Tell the kids that nowadays and they wouldn’t believe you.

Well, when you're always taught that water and electricity don't mix, you couldn't really blame someone for not believing that pouring water on a 12v battery was a good thing

I've never had furry battery posts on a vehicle in 50+ years of ownership, because I always grease them; with petroleum jelly (aka Vaseline) in the old days, more recently a spray of white grease.

The one and only time I've had it was after the battery (at 7 years old) failed and even then it was more a light dusting of white powder than any form of fur coat.

[ndevans]

Vaseline has worked fine for battery terminals for many years by many persons. What advantage does battery clamp grease have over it?

I won't be pouring water on a battery any time soon, certainly not boiling. Hot tap water might be ok but boiling I would think risks cracking the plastic of the battery case- I'm not inclined to try it myself.

[svenedin]

Vaseline has worked fine for battery terminals for many years by many persons. What advantage does battery clamp grease have over it?

I won't be pouring water on a battery any time soon, certainly not boiling. Hot tap water might be ok but boiling I would think risks cracking the plastic of the battery case- I'm not inclined to try it myself.

What advantage? Vaseline just prevents contact with air or water and does a pretty good job. Battery clamp grease has corrosion inhibitors in it as well. In real life, probably not much difference.

Stephen

[panky]

I use a smear of dialectric grease on electrical contacts.it's a silicone-based grease designed to protect electrical connections—such as spark plugs, wiring, and terminals—from salt, dirt, and corrosion.


https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/376679720593 ... M9QTYP5JCB

[geoberni]

I use a smear of dialectric grease on electrical contacts.it's a silicone-based grease designed to protect electrical connections—such as spark plugs, wiring, and terminals—from salt, dirt, and corrosion.

I'm sure it works fine in open spaces, but I'm wary of silicone grease ever since first encountering it in the mid 70s.
An equipment, amongst others, which I was servicing at the time had an unexplained increase in it's failure rate, due to open circuit micro-switches.
An investigation revealed that the manufacturer had changed to using a silicone grease in the item's gearbox.
The significantly increased failure rate of the micro-switches was traced to a 'glass' on the contact surface of the switches .
This was then traced to fumes from the silicone grease entering the micro-switches as they were not hermetically sealed.
Root cause, the minute arching of the switch contacts was forming 'glass' on their surfaces.

This was way back in the day when the RAF overhauled/maintained much of the equipment fitted to it's aircraft in it's own facilities, so such things would be investigated, to reduce the failures... The RAF informed the manufacturer of their error and they reverted back to the original grease.
Now the MoD trusts 'Industry' to do everything for them....

But the moral of the tale is don't use silicone grease in the distributor where the points are minutely arching

[mike1864]

As ever, useful info from geoberni.
All unsealed contacts are susceptible to airborne corrosion.
Fifty years ago the BBC had a Cardiff TV facility that had ongoing technical issues, which were eventually traced to corroded relay contacts. At that time, the atmosphere in this industrial suburb (Splott) was heavily polluted. So further outages were subsequently logged as "due to Splott-grot".

[jaekl]

Silicone migrates and is difficult to eliminate. Plating facilities and paint shops try not to have any silicone present. It results in finish failure. Fresh contacts are plated to survive the environments they are intended to reside. When the plating wear, corrosion can form. The appropriate greases must be able to be fully displaced as required when the contacts are mated. They have no electrical properties, just the ability to keep dirt, oxygen, and other gases out. Silicone film is more difficult to displace.

[panky]

Better not use it then

[eng622]

Battery voltage 12.6 V and on cranking 10.0. Choke out a little car would not start but on releasing the key there was a small puff of smoke from the air cleaner. Put the battery charger on for about 2 minutes pulled the choke out more and it started instantly and cranking V was higher at 10.5.

[ndevans]

Now try checking the voltage at the starter solenoid terminals when you are starting it.

[mike1864]

And on the "ignition" terminal of the coil. It should be the same 10-10.5 volts when cranking, and virtually the same as the battery when not cranking.

[geoberni]

And on the "ignition" terminal of the coil. It should be the same 10-10.5 volts when cranking, and virtually the same as the battery when not cranking.

Exactly.
An ohm here and there between the battery and the Coil, at Ign Sw, or fuse holder connections for example, and that'll effectively stop any chance of a decent spark.

[myoldjalopy]

And is there a decent spark? Stephen suggested testing for a spark (amongst other things) earlier in this thread but no word from the OP whether this has been done.....

[mike1864]

So you'll need to check that the coil's ignition terminal stays close to 12V when the points are closed, ie when the (3 ohm) coil is demanding 4 Amps. You can't properly measure this on a moving engine.
Re-thinking about it, the 10 volts the OP measured when cranking suggests a low (ie wrong) momentary voltage when the points were closed; the meter giving an average of this square (ish!) wave, depending on the dwell angle.
One way to check for a high resistance in the coil's battery feed is to use the starting handle to PARK the points in their closed position, and check there's only a small voltage drop (well under a volt?) at the coil's IGN terminal.
If there's a big drop, as geoberni says, check the cleanliness of all connections and that all wires are fully crimped in their respective connectors.
In a non-emergency scenario, I'd keep the checking the meter after every wiggle/re-crimp; just so's you know when you've found the culprit