Morris Minor Owners Club

How much pedal travel is normal? I changed the front wheel cylinders and brake shoes, bleeded and adjusted all 4 brakes. Now I can create blocking wheels by braking at 30 mph, but have to push the pedal almost up to the floor. Is this normal, or should I have smaller pedal travel?

Did you have long pedal travel before changing the parts? If not then it is unlikely that flexi hoses went baloony overnoght. Tip about snagging brake adjuster is a good one!

If you're shure the bleeding is ok (it never a bad idea to repeat it after using the car a bit) then personally I suspect it is partly badly fitting shoes - until they bed in they don't fit the drum well and when you press the pedal you flex the shoe to fit the drum. I've had similar problems with new shoes and now would never replace them soon before an MOT incase they take a week or 2 to bed in.

I keep a set JUST for the MOT - fit them before, take them off after - wrap up and put away till next year !

Thanks for your replies!

Did you have long pedal travel before changing the parts?

No I did not, but the drums were not even anymore and on the front wheels only one the cylinders was working. I had to adjust the brake shoes very close (even no free running without braking) to the drum to get a good braking power. That caused hot brakes and the reason why I exchanged all parts.

personally I suspect it is partly badly fitting shoes

I also had milled the drums, so this could be the cause. I will adjust them one more time to see if thast solves the problem

Be sure to slacken off the handbrake cables - then adjust the rear brakes

I did not check this. But now I will!!

Thanks again!


Theo

Ah - 'milled' the drums ! Surely 'turned' would be better - anyhow - you have increased the diameter and so only the tip of the shoe will be touching until it rapidly wears down and slowly more and more of the shoe will touch. Better raise the rear end of the shoes slightly - with shims.

Or buy new correct diameter drums. They are not expensive and well worth it as good working brakes are essential!

I also had milled the drums, so this could be the cause. I will adjust them one more time to see if thast solves the problem

As mentioned alsready - that is likely to be part (or most) of the problem. The shoes need to be a very good fit to the drums to give a firm pedal.
I'd also recommend new drums as they are cheaper than machining the old ones (unless you got it done for free) and they will have more metal! More metal means you get brake fade less often!

I agree 100% with the comments made. When we got our current minor some 6 years ago I had brake judder so got the front drums skimmed, a complete waste of money. The drums were now too large for the shoes so only part of the linings were in contact (as has been said), brake performance was lousy and of course you could not adjust the brakes properly. A new set of drums solved all. HOWEVER, we are getting brake judder back again, the drums have done about 25k miles and they are 7" so I assume one has warped slightly again, aftermarket stuff does not last as long as original equipment!
Nigel

If it had seized cylinders before, and has also been bled, it could be the master. As more cylinders are now working, it has to travel a bit further, and could be hitting wear in the bore. Plus during bleeding the seal will have seen the previously unknown depths of the master, and might have had to travel over a wear ridge several times, increasing the chances of damaging it.

I don't know if this is a common problem on Minors, but I've experienced similar in other single cirtcuit cars, and it's not fun to go from low pedal but working, to boards and no brakes!

BMCECOSSE.....do you sell those special shoes for the MOT?? If so
I'll have a set you cunning devil.

Hello everyone,
Everything everyone has said so far is spot on but one thing no one's mentioned is the pushrod between the pedal and the master cyl. It is adjustable in length. It shouldn't need adjusting but someone might have set it to the wrong length in the past. With the pedal in the up position, there should be enough clearance so it doesnt touch the m/c and cause any pressure in the system but too much clearance will mean the pedal already has to travel before any slack is taken up and the cylinder can start pumping. Worth Checking?
Cheers, Colin.

No willie- it's just a newish set that have been 'run in' - so I keep them in their sets - marked for each wheel - and the rest of the time I run with other slightly more worn shoes. It's a bit of work - but it saves that struggle with brake balance at MOT time.
Also do the same with windscreen wipers ! Fit for MOT - remove nd wrap in tissue paper till next year. Big pile of old ones to use up the reast of the year. You will by now have realised I come from Scotland !!

COLIN... that is a fair point but when I experimented with this
adjustment I was shocked to find that the rod was only holding
on by very few threads. It may have been a one off situation but
should be carefully checked if going down this road.

BMC

Yes, I recognised the syptoms - heater turned on all year, lots of (used) wiper blades ... thinks, where's cold all year and wet?

Oh yes, Scotland

Where my wife says "there's a nce home counties accent ! ..." (her home - Fife).

Colin

Willie wrote:COLIN... that is a fair point but when I experimented with this
adjustment I was shocked to find that the rod was only holding
on by very few threads. It may have been a one off situation but
should be carefully checked if going down this road.

Thanks Willie - I was trying to make that point last night, but I couldn't find the eloquence that you have, and gave up. It's not a one off, BTW - something you find once, and are forever after very, very wary of...
a

Now now Colin - be fair - we have had a super summer so far this year ! And Fife is drier than the rest - unfortunately I am in the middle bit south of Glasgow - wetter than the rest..

Thanks for your replies.

I did check the fitting of the (new) shoes in the (machined) drums: they fitted very well I think.

This weekend I adjusted the brakes again, and could add 1 more notch on the frontbrakes. By this it improved.

I also checked the pushrod: It's hard to get a good view on the actual position to the m/c, but it probably needs some adjustment (no thread visible at all).