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Re: MM Tourer - where it all began...
Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:20 pm
by warweezil
For a while we lived at St Davids while my Grandmother lived in Monkton, I Remember Sunday nights with dad hammering the van to get on the last trip on the Cleddau King over from Neyland to drop me off for the coming week at the old Coro' school in Upper Meyrick St.
Dad worked for Turiff on the Gas conversion across Wales, when they were covering the South Pembrokeshire area they based the operation at the old Llanion Barracks, which of course is now all housing. The council offices are at Haverfordwest since they re-re-organised local Government in the 90's, the old Officers Mess now houses the National Park Authority, the council has a Customer Service centre on the site of the old Coronation Upper school in Argyle st.
The last bit of the Dockyard has now closed, all the heavy industry at Pembroke Dock - Shipbuilding and steel pressings is all gone, the Fishing fleet is now just a few boats on Crab and Lobster and it looks like another refinery is going. Brawdy is closing - having been run right down over many years, and the old armaments depots have closed
Not great prospects around here right now.
Re: MM Tourer - where it all began...
Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:40 pm
by Mark Wilson
Enjoying this thread.

So am I - Dad always did like to get a discussion going! We only made it to Wales once, when he did get his own car in about 1958. That was a 1939 Hillman Minx and we were grateful it made it from Preston, Lancs all the way to Rhyll and back. South Wales was well out of range........
Re: MM Tourer - where it all began...
Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 9:37 am
by philthehill
Mark
I am glad you are enjoying this thread the only problem is that I can and do go on and on and on >>>>>>>>>>>.
There is still a Sunderland No: T9044 at Pembroke Dock but not many people get to see her as she is at the bottom of the Haven.
She sank at her moorings and was complete at the time of her sinking. There have been proposals to raise her and put her on show.
http://www.divetheworld.com/Diving/warb ... /index.htm
The armaments depot (Milford Mine Depot) is mentioned - my father worked there for a time in the 1950s. As a child I was never allowed inside the gate but some years before I retired I was taken around the Haven accompanied by The Queens Harbourmaster in the Port Authorities launch which included visiting the old Pembroke power station site, one of the refineries jetties and the Mine Depot
A Coles 10ton rail mounted crane that originated from the buoyage yard at Pembroke Dock was under my charge for a while.
Cleddau King and not forgetting Cleddau Queen. The ramp at Hobbs Point was so steep cars quite often ended up in the Haven especially at low tide when the ramp was still wet and slimy
Everything changes and not always for the better (and do not mention the price of petrol back then)

Re: MM Tourer - where it all began...
Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 10:14 am
by warweezil
Yes the momentum for that seems to have been lost - I was referring to M2824 dismantled and removed in 1971, I was lucky enough to visit before she left. There is an article about it on the web written by the son of a (late) teacher of mine at the Coro - Phil is co author of a book about the history of the area, Im sure his father would have been proud of this documenting of more modern local history, all too often Pembroke Dock falls into the shadow of Pembroke with the historic castle etc.
The Cleddau Queen.. the ugly sister of the pair, started life as a "paddler" but was later converted to Diesel screw, totally unsuited for the job as she lacked the ramp arrangement for Hobbs Point slip and so was provided with moveable wooden wedgeblocks to facilitate cars to move on/off at a 90 degree angle to the fall of the slip (which as you know is quite steep), It was fun to watch the Queen in operation during the early summer when the King was away at Overhaul, a falling tide or a wet day and suddenly cars were sliding sideways across the cobbles on skinny cross-ply tyres carrying slightly terrified looking tourists towards the waters edge, or the days of finding traffic queued back to the Criterion because of extreme low tides which prevented the king from accessing the bottom of Hobbs point slip. The Queen also made lief difficult for me when I was on the Tudor prince as we shared the side of Hobbs Point when the Queen was working.
The old Tudor Prince has now returned down south I understand it is being restored to its former glory as the Torbay Prince, no one has mentioned the 2 MTBS that were moored slightly up river from the Warrior. Ivor Crockford (skipper of the Prince) used to refer to them in his commentary on the up river cruises as being formerly HMS Brave Borderer and HMS Brave Swordsman, I believe they were here for a while in connection with some sort of off shore naval training
Milford Mine Depot, Trecwn Armaments depot, Pembroke Dock Mooring & Salvage Depot, Llanion barracks have all gone, Cawdor barracks (formerly RNAS/RAF/USAF Brawdy) is to close (or has already) all the miltary stuff has gone except Castlemartin, Penally which seems to be mainly weekend stuff and some training still goes on around Manorbier although the main establishment has long gone.
The power station has of course been rebuilt, The old Gulf Refinery and the former Esso site are now LNG terminals (offering far less employment that in previous roles) Amoco (now Murco) is on its way out it seems, some years ago I worked for Marine & Port Services down river on the tankers, that sort of traffic is now just a memory. Even the conservancy board are cutting boat crew numbers.
WL Silcox, former BMC Dealer in Pembroke Dock, who supplied many Morris cars in the area went to the wall about 12 years ago, and recently rumours have emerged that the sister bus/coach firm has changed hands, The old Pembrokeshire Police had BMC vehicles, an Austin Westminster manual (Dad had a '65 grey automatic) and a blue Morris van that stopped me at The Green in Pembroke one day where an old school copper gave me a real telling off for riding my 10 speed racer at over 30mph on my way home from on one of the rare days when the lollipop lady on Bush hill didnt stop traffic as I approached.
At the risk of sounding like some sad old fart, I had a great childhood here, abandoned army camps to explore, old quarrys full on dumped cars from the 40's and 50's, wow if I could go back! The cars! Vehicles with character and quirks, (yes and rust) Cars you could repair, I'm depressed at the sight of the cars we break at work purely because the repair costs are too high, not because they are missing floors or parts of chassis - dad had an A55 Cambridge (early farina 1500 engine) that had the old coal pre-pack bags under the carpets to keep the worst of thew water out when the roads were wet. Moderns are great... but they have removed the soul from motoring, I don't see a "modern Morris Minor" emerging with such a following.
My apologies for hijacking the thread like this, but in the last couple of days, and at a rather late stage in life I have just realised what a fascinating area this is.
Re: MM Tourer - where it all began...
Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:14 pm
by philthehill
I do not remember the two MTBs but do remember the RAF fast rescue craft and the boom defence craft with the heavy lift hoists on their prows.
Here is a link which may be of interest:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave-clas ... atrol_boat
The reference to being targets is interesting and may have had something to do with Castlemartin as they still use sea targets which when not in use are moored in the Haven at Pembroke Dock.
When the Tall Ships race was at Milford I took my trailer sailer down to Neyland (Brunel Quay) and sailed up the river to Cresswell Quay and even then there was a lot of Pembroke Dock stuff moored in trots above the old NATO depot at Burton.
It is good to reminisce and I had a very good childhood on/in and around the Cleddau and thankfully in later life I have had many interesting and enjoyable jobs.
The Haven is a most interesting place and has lots of history, has a most wonderful collection of Palmerston Follies
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmerston_Forts
It is a most beautiful place especially above Benton Castle reach where the commercialism of the Haven is left behind

.
Re: MM Tourer - where it all began...
Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 3:37 pm
by Mark Wilson
Phil, with the incredibly knowledgeable contributions you make elsewhere, you are more than welcome to ramble on a bit! Can't contribute anything to the naval history theme, but there is a defence industry angle as the young draughtsman standing with the MM Tourer at the beginning of this thread eventually became Chief Production Engineer for British Aerospace's military division.
Re: MM Tourer - where it all began...
Posted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:12 pm
by philthehill
Mark
Thank you
I am interested in just about everything mechanical and historical - both ancient and modern.
Unfortunately (and some say thank god) I did not attain the post of Chief Production Engineer but my defence industry angle was that in the early 1980s I was the Production Planner for a REME workshop that turned over in excess of 32,000 repair hours a year and which had also repaired Morris Minor staff cars (travellers) when they were the preferred make/style of small staff car.
Happy days.
Phil