Morris Minor Owners Club

bmcecosse wrote:I told you Russel would be good - just for my information - could you please PM me the name of the 'garage' ?? been blanked out in the I see it has mysteriously original post !

Before making insinuations please read the post fully

edited by moggiefan on Wed Aug 11 2010 8:33 pm,

billobban wrote:My post was to highlight the fact that the last time a respected member of our on line community mentioned your previous repairer on this forum they were banned after carrying out work for someone in the same situation as your goodselves.

Well that part of your posting is not based on true facts.

Kevin wrote:

billobban wrote:My post was to highlight the fact that the last time a respected member of our on line community mentioned your previous repairer on this forum they were banned after carrying out work for someone in the same situation as your goodselves.

Well that part of your posting is not based on true facts.

Your post is based on your interpretation of the facts which differ somewhat from mine and many others and with reference to the pm you sent me I am a modest mechanical engineer without the benefit of a degree in the English language but you appear to read something in my post in my post that I dont! To claim that I was critisising Jonathon Heap is ludicrous!

Well.... I knew what you were on about bill and it was not critisizing JLH. (By the way I DO have a degree in English Literature cant spell worth a jot though so maybe I am qualified to comment)
I think I will just take myself off to the other place wher I am assured I will feel more welcome

I have decided to remove all of our posts in this thread as it's all got a bit out of hand.

Many thanks to the forum members who have taken time to offer us advice.

I'd be obliged if you would remove any text or pictures you've quoted from me.

moggiefan, have you had any success at dialogue with whatever company worked on your car? May I suggest if so that you keep a documented record of all efforts to communicate with them in attempts to correct workmanship issues. I wuold also suggest that you also take up this issues with the club commitee as I would imagine our committee would support a member and assist where possible in matters relating to so called reputable firms producing carp work on a great marque and their intervention maybe just the ticket to encourage said firm to actually try and correct things.

I would certainly consider taking them to court and an independant assement of the vehicle would help with this.

I hope your case works out and everything comes to a suitable close for you.

I have decided to remove all of our posts in this thread as it's all got a bit out of hand.

Many thanks to the forum members who have taken time to offer us advice.

I'd be obliged if you would remove any text or pictures you've quoted from me.

Moggiefan

I think you did the sensible thing to blank out the name of the supplier as open criticism of suppliers is not allowed on this forum.

We all have to adhere to this and I can see why it is necessary. It galls most of us that the few poor suppliers/restorers cannot be openly named and criticised here but if it were allowed it could quite likely end up in action being taken by them to have the site closed down.

There is nothing to prevent you sending a pm to anyone who enquires the suppliers name and you can also report the problems you and others have had to the MMOC via links on this site.

Everyone who posts with problems about this firm can help others by giving discreet clues and most people regularly using this forum will know who is being refered to.

If they cant work it out from the clues or are new to the forum then they can just PM the author of the post and ask.

There are also some people who appear to be quite satisfied with the service they have had from this particular firm??

I "hope" the club is listening........ ????

It's more than ... "quite a failure of service"
It's downright criminal and an endangerment to your life.

Sorry to hear of your problems moggiefan but I really suggest that you take Rob's advice and forward full details to the club secretary Ray Newell. And Gormley, I suggest that you do the same. The problem is that "untold other members" have not forwarded complaints - in fact the club receives very few complaints at all about traders. I appreciate that this is a stressful time for you but please re-consider providing details to the club. People are quick to criticise the club for failing to do anything but if members don't forward the details how can the matter be looked into?

taupe wrote:Everyone who posts with problems about this firm can help others by giving discreet clues and most people regularly using this forum will know who is being referred to. If they cant work it out from the clues or are new to the forum then they can just PM the author of the post and ask.

I know it is said here a lot, but as a reminder to members who are new to the messageboard, if you are considering having work done, or need some advice about where to get parts etc please post a message here to ask. As Taupe says, if members have any negative comments they can be forwarded via personal message (Moggiefan - did you pm the member here who offered to provide you with advice previously? http://www.mmoc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=27230)

And also consider joining your local branch as members there will be able to tell you who the good and not so good traders are in your local area. And always thoroughly inspect a car before purchase as a nice shiney car can sometimes be hiding a multitude of sins. If you don’t know what to look for take someone with you who does. Once you have a Minor get a workshop manual and familiarise yourself with the basics. I’m certainly no mechanic but a Minor is very easy to work on and there is a lot of maintenance that is easy to do yourself once you get confident about what everything is under the bonnet. I leave work on safety critical areas to the ‘experts’ but a decent workshop manual will help you to identify simple fixes (and save you money!), and of course this site is a mine of information so there will always be someone here who will be able to answer your questions and offer advice.

Just a (legal) thought - would not The Club be exposing themselves to risk of litigation if it could be shown that they knew of a serious problem with the quality of work of a particular firm, and failed to warn the very members that they owe a duty of care to?

Ratbag

A very good point! I would like to see a legal opinion on this one.

Duty of care may apply to the MMOC which regard to the events it puts on, the things it is directly linked to, but i doubt it would extend to third parties such as independent businesses who would owe their own duty of care to the customer.Besides, is it written anywhere in MMOC rules, code of conduct ect that it has to as a club advise upon the quality of any business connected to Morris Minors, beyond that of word of mouth recommendations?

There may be an element of responsibility when they carry advertisements for the firm in question in the MMOC Club Magazine. And then there are repeated well informed stories of poor service by that firm in the Forum run by the MMOC.......... To continue to carry the advertisement could arguably be deemed to be irresponsible.

bmcecosse wrote:There may be an element of responsibility when they carry advertisements for the firm in question in the MMOC Club Magazine.

The magazine clearly states “Acceptance of advertising does not imply recommendation of advertisers, their products or their services”

And then there are repeated well informed stories of poor service by that firm in the Forum run by the MMOC..........

But there are also posts from others who are more than happy with the work / service provided. Personally I wouldn’t comment on the workmanship of a trader unless I had first hand experience of it but there some here who have been very vocal with their criticism despite having never actually used the services of the company in question. Unfortunately people are often quick to jump to conclusions without knowing all of the facts - it happens a lot on internet forums - and not everything you read on the internet is true.

As previously stated, the problem is that members are not providing the Club with details of their complaints. Obviously in the first instance if you are dissatisfied with a product or service provided you should contact the supplier. If they do not resolve the matter to your satisfaction then forward full details to the Club. It is impossible for anyone to make an informed decision without knowing all of the facts. For instance, when was the work carried out, what exactly was done, were there any guarantees, what has happened in the meantime, has someone else worked on the car, has it been properly maintained, does the complainant have receipts and a record of contact / correspondence with the trader etc etc. You have to be fair to all parties, particularly when someone's livelihood is at stake, as it is not unheard of for people to have other motives for making complaints.

As an aside, there are some very good recommendations provided within the magazine for any member considering professional restoration work. This includes:

Take out legal expenses insurance to provide advice in the event of a dispute and to pay legal fees in the event of the case going to court.

Ask to see examples of the firm’s work & facilities, also talk to other members who have had work completed by the firm.

Obtain a copy of the firm’s guarantee regarding parts and workmanship.

Visit the car during restoration, and when completed inspect the car before you take delivery and / or part with any money.

Should you have a complaint and a phone call does not produce a response, inform the company in writing and send by recorded delivery.

Obtain a statement of any rectification work.

Always retain originals of estimates and receipts and a copy of all communications.

And there you have it!

" But there are also posts from others who are more than happy with the work / service provided."
Hmm - not noticed any of these lately - can you pop up some examples please Louise ?

Well "popping up some examples" would identify the company that is being referred to If you do a search though Roy you'll see that not all comments are negative, and some are in threads that you've posted in. The point is that members need to be proactive and forward the details of any complaints that they have about traders to the club so that the matter can be looked into.