Rear Seatbelts

[mrs.smith2012]

I am reluctantly coming to the conclusion that I may need to fit rear seatbelts in Nell

I don’t really want to, she’s nice and tidy at the back and I feel like seatbelts will ruin it a bit… but the reality is I want to use her more on trips and as there are 4 of us in the house and we generally travel together it’s becoming a bit inconvenient to have to keep taking two cars everywhere when technically we could all fit in Nell.

Just wondering who has done the same, were you happy with how it looked and what sort of costs are involved? I’m aware that this is a job I’ll have to get a professional to do and not just ‘have a go’ myself like I try to do with most things!

[Chief]

My four door came with inertia reel style ones fitted, they're very uncomfortable (I added in those wrap around foam seatbelt cushions) as they had a metal part on the belt which I'm sure in an accident would break your shoulder.

They didn't look so bad fitted, but I've removed them (they can easily be bolted back on if really required) as they damaged the rear seat fabric through compression tightness and now with replacement rear seats I don't want them to be damaged again, in removing them I actually found one of the strengthening plates had split in two and was only being held together by waxoyl.

That said, if I wanted to refit them I'd have to remove the rear wheel arch liners as I also replaced them and don't want to put holes through them for the belts like the old ones had.

it’s becoming a bit inconvenient to have to keep taking two cars everywhere when technically we could all fit in Nell.

So don't brake hard, crash or get crashed into and everyone can go in the car in perfect safety

[mrs.smith2012]

Haha I’ll try not to!

The front belts she has aren’t too bad, although they were probably fitted back in the 70s.. not sure how back ones would work without spoiling the look of the car. I can’t see where the seatbelts would sit if that makes sense

I’ll research carefully before I make any decisions

[svenedin]

Rear inertia reel seatbelts can look rather awful if the reels are mounted on the rear parcel shelf. This is a particular problem with a convertible as the rear screen will hit the reels and get damaged when the roof is folded down. Instead, the reels can be mounted under the shelf in the boot and the are less intrusive then. Rear seat belts do make folding the rear seat down much more difficult but many owners do this very infrequently.


Stephen

[Chief]

So, using this image as an example:


The chunky inertia reels on mine sit side-by-side on the rear parcel shelf, directly under the center of the rear window, the nuts are accessible in the boot.

The mounting flat bracket (in the image shown sitting on the belt just below the inertia reels) goes down under the rear seat base and bolts through the metal floor there, the nuts accessible by crawling under the car.

The things to the right that the belts click into, they're bolted through the rear wheel arch liners (here's an image of the old arch liner, the bolt is the off-screen dark patch in the left of the image, just above the exposed yellow foam)., through the inner wing, through a strengthening plate:

[svenedin]

In my car the inertia reels are attached to the underside of the parcel shelf. This prevents the easily scratched convertible rear screen from being damaged when the roof is folded down. This was a tip from another member on this forum. It also looks tidier I think. The only reason I had rear seatbelts installed was so that my dog is properly restrained. I did not want the dog, or me, at risk under heavy braking or an accident.

Stephen

IMG_3574.JPG (243.2 KiB) Viewed 3305 times

[Sleeper]

Like so...

seatbelt1.jpg (152.64 KiB) Viewed 3120 times

seatbelt2.jpg (148.69 KiB) Viewed 3120 times

seatbelt4.jpg (132.28 KiB) Viewed 3120 times

John ;-)

P.S. Re. the insulation , A tin box is Cold in Winter,Hot in Summer....

[moggiethouable]

I think this installation of inertia reels very tidy indeed.
For my part I fitted none inertia types, simply in keeping with the times, I am still not sure when inertia reels came in to being.
But either way it doesnt matter really.
We have them for the grandkids kiddy seats.

[mowogg]

I don't want to be controversial, but I don't think this is a good instillation. The seat belt runs through the parcel shelf and then is more or less vertical to get to the top of the seat. In the event of an accident the force on the belt will be horizontal, and the seat top will be crushed to the parcel shelf level as the frame is not very strong. This which will effectively lengthen he seat belt by this height allowing the passenger to shunt forwards.

I think it could be modified to be better but it would need a strong frame on top of the parcel shelf to change the height of the belt pivot to above he height of the seat

[Sleeper]

Mowogg

I concur , the extra 2 inches I regard as a " crumple zone" , but as the only back-seat passenger I ever have is the Mother-in-law , I'm not really too bothered.

John

[59Elva]

Isn’t the seat back high grade plywood? Wouldn’t think it would compress very much. Even unrestrained, rear seat passengers are at a lower risk. This coming from a crash surviving unrestrained driver.

[geoberni]

Isn’t the seat back high grade plywood? Wouldn’t think it would compress very much. Even unrestrained, rear seat passengers are at a lower risk. This coming from a crash surviving unrestrained driver.

I wouldn't call it 'high grade', it's not particularly thick either.
The biggest hazard from unrestrained rear objects, people dogs or other items, would be the weight hitting the front seats and adding further to the injuries of the front occupants.
Basil hasn't got any belts, with the original steering column, the flat screen about 2" away from your hands, the flimsy SII seats.... I think belts aren't going to help much.
At Basil's 'restoration' circa 1999, he was even fitted with a metal front parcel shelf across the shins....to remove it will require some effort cutting off the welds.

I regard him as having the same safety concerns as driving anything pre-war, such as an Austin 7 or Morris 8.
.
.

Edit: One of the perils of re-reading one of your own posts, is spotting silly typos that your feel honour bound to correct ....

[svenedin]

Let's face it, as Berni say our cars will never meet modern standards of safety no matter what we do. The design is so old that all we can do is make small improvements. We cannot do anything about the inherent shortcomings of a car designed without crumple zones, a sold non-collapsible steering column etc. BMC did experiment with thinner steel on the bonnet and wings but this was short-lived as it did not improve safety. It is surely better to have seatbelts than to be completely unrestrained in an accident. I recall seeing a film from the 1940's or 50's where the car manufacturers were trying to argue that seatbelts were dangerous and it was safer to be "thrown clear" in an accident. Madness!

Stephen

[59Elva]

What a head going 30mph does to a Minor windshield.

[moggiethouable]

I recall the "dished" original steering wheel being designed for safety reasons under impact.
It was termed the "dished safety steering wheel" a good reason perhaps for keeping it.
Additionally the soft sun visors for the same reason, I would warn people off fitting perspex tinted internal sun visors, at the wrong angle if the head is thrown forward a lot of damage can be done to the face.
We rely very heavily on air bags and crumple zones saving us under impact, at slow speeds I am sure they help, but there is also a feeling of invincibility conveyed because of our modern safety measures.
The fact remains we are fragile and seat belts can only help.
As someone in my distant past used to remind me from the passenger seat if I was a little too quick
"fragile cargo dear, fragile cargo"

[mrs.smith2012]

Thanks for all the responses everyone.

I’m still really torn… from an aesthetic point of view I don’t want rear seatbelts at all - although I must admit the seatbelts in Stephen’s picture do look very tidy… was this a professional job?

But if I want to use Nell as a regular family car for days out etc then it’s something I’ll have to give serious consideration to as I definitely don’t want loose passengers in the back! That windscreen pic was horrific (was the driver okay??)

Heading to a show on Sunday so hopefully there might be a few moggies there with seatbelts fitted so I can have a nosy!

[59Elva]

Yes Mrs. Smith I (the driver) did manage to limp away. Nothing broken. Whiplash, banged up knees and a bunch of bruises. What seemed like a minor back injury grew into a serious spinal infection that took five months to correctly diagnose.
It happened so quickly that there was no time to react. No braking, steering, or even bracing for impact. The strange thing is I don’t remember hearing the crash. Maybe hitting my head drowned out the sound?
An insurance company doctor said it was a minor impact because my airbag didn’t deploy. I guess you can get a medical degree without knowing anything at all about automotive history. The woman who hit me was trapped in her Toyota by all the deployed airbags.
Bill B

[svenedin]

Thanks for all the responses everyone.

I’m still really torn… from an aesthetic point of view I don’t want rear seatbelts at all - although I must admit the seatbelts in Stephen’s picture do look very tidy… was this a professional job?

But if I want to use Nell as a regular family car for days out etc then it’s something I’ll have to give serious consideration to as I definitely don’t want loose passengers in the back! That windscreen pic was horrific (was the driver okay??)

Heading to a show on Sunday so hopefully there might be a few moggies there with seatbelts fitted so I can have a nosy!

Yes it is a professional job from Morris Minor Workshop in East Sussex. The hood is down at the moment so it is not a great photo. I'm not putting the hood back up when it is 30 C just to take a photo! It is smart and tidy where the belt goes through the parcel shelf.

I think in 36 years of ownership I have sat in the back twice!

Stephen

IMG_3577.jpeg (2.37 MiB) Viewed 2218 times

[mrs.smith2012]

Yes Mrs. Smith I (the driver) did manage to limp away. Nothing broken. Whiplash, banged up knees and a bunch of bruises. What seemed like a minor back injury grew into a serious spinal infection that took five months to correctly diagnose.
It happened so quickly that there was no time to react. No braking, steering, or even bracing for impact. The strange thing is I don’t remember hearing the crash. Maybe hitting my head drowned out the sound?
An insurance company doctor said it was a minor impact because my airbag didn’t deploy. I guess you can get a medical degree without knowing anything at all about automotive history. The woman who hit me was trapped in her Toyota by all the deployed airbags.
Bill B

Oh that is awful! I’m so sorry that happened
I’m glad you’re okay now but how scary!

[mrs.smith2012]

Thanks for all the responses everyone.

I’m still really torn… from an aesthetic point of view I don’t want rear seatbelts at all - although I must admit the seatbelts in Stephen’s picture do look very tidy… was this a professional job?

But if I want to use Nell as a regular family car for days out etc then it’s something I’ll have to give serious consideration to as I definitely don’t want loose passengers in the back! That windscreen pic was horrific (was the driver okay??)

Heading to a show on Sunday so hopefully there might be a few moggies there with seatbelts fitted so I can have a nosy!

I think in 36 years of ownership I have sat in the back twice!

Stephen

IMG_3577.jpeg

It’s been done very well, but yeah, that’s what is making me delay… although it would be handy to be able to squeeze the whole family in the car, both my mother in law and housemate find Nell quite uncomfortable to ride in and I’d be annoyed if I go to the trouble of putting seatbelts in and they decide they would rather just take the modern anyway

I’ll have to have serious talks with them before any decisions are made