Almost broke down!

[mrs.smith2012]

Afternoon all,
Took Nell out for a drive this afternoon. She started fine, about 10 mins in we were driving down a country lane and she felt a bit ‘weird.’ I can’t describe it… sort of clunky at the back.

Turned her round and took her a bit further up the lane, she felt okay so we stopped off and had a coffee in the car. When I tried to start her afterwards she started, then coughed and died, this happened several times. Popped the bonnet, nothing looked amiss. Started her again and gave her some throttle and a bit more choke. She started… was absolutely fine coming back.

Husband noticed black smoke on start up but only on start up, she didn’t continue to smoke.

She had hazard lights retro fitted this morning, had it done by a professional auto electrician so it was done properly. It was a very long fiddly job and her ignition was on a fair bit while he was checking power etc… could it be that that’s caused her to have a bit of a wobble?

Like I said she was fine coming home but a little nervous to go back out not knowing if there could be an issue? Any advice on what my next steps should be would be most welcome. I have a good friend who is quite clued up on classics, and I will have him over to take a look, but not able to get in touch with him right now so wondering if there is anything I can check in the meantime?

[myoldjalopy]

'clunky at the back' - for how long? Maybe you just drove over a fallen branch, or a sheep, or something?
Black smoke on start-up likely 'a bit more' choke.
Have a look at the rear and see if anything caught in the axle etc. Pop the bonnet and start engine and rev a bit. If all seems well, go for a drive.

[Myrtles Man]

"her ignition was on a fair bit while he was checking power etc"

It's possible that this may have caused the coil to overheat, leading to partial failure.

[mrs.smith2012]

Lol a sheep

Clunky probably isn’t the best word, she just didn’t feel quite right, like she was dragging a bit. As we hadn’t driven for very long before we stopped she wasn’t fully warmed up so still had a bit of choke on when we attempted a restart.. perhaps too much?

We got her home fine and I’ve checked her all round, nothing obvious. I did speak to my friend and he said the same thing about the coil. We are already planning to change or at least clean her spark plugs on Sunday as they look like they haven’t been touched in a while and have a fair bit of build up on them, but this isn’t new so don’t know why this would suddenly cause a problem.

Unfortunately it’s a bit dark for me to drive now so I’ve tucked her up for the night, but perhaps I’ll take her for a run tomorrow (weather permitting) and see how she goes? I think her not wanting to start has just made me a little nervous… even though I’m sure it’s nothing really serious

[mobylette]

Very strange to have the ignition on for this job. The hazards are intended to operate with the ignition on or off. Not sure what has gone on here? Also very easy to disconnect the coil if you need the ignition switch on.

[mrs.smith2012]

Very strange to have the ignition on for this job. The hazards are intended to operate with the ignition off. Not sure what has gone on here? Also very easy to disconnect the coil if you need the ignition switch on.

Hazards do work without ignition but there were some issues with old wiring so the mechanic did have turn the ignition on several times while checking bits and pieces. He may have disconnected the coil to be honest, me being a total noob would not know

Honestly I’m probably over worrying! It’s just the first time in 3 weeks of owning her that she has actually refused to start on me… although as a 65 year old lady, she’s entitled to have her ‘off days’ I guess!

[mobylette]

Fingers crossed just a coincidence then, take out for a good run and get the engine fully warmed up. Hopefully all will be well

[mike1864]

"her ignition was on a fair bit while he was checking power etc"

It's possible that this may have caused the coil to overheat, leading to partial failure.

Agreed. If one of the coil's internal wires has become JUST disconnected, any heating or vibration can result in your intermittent symptoms. It's not reparable, but hitting the coil with a hammer MAY just jog it into failing, or into working if already failed. But it may then stick (precariously) in that state.
So I'd replace it anyway before the next journey.
Also check the connectors to it are fully plugged in, and all the strands of the wires are held in these connectors.
Your electrician should be able to help with much of the above, eg metering the coil.

[mobylette]

And always carry a spare coil!

[Bill_qaz]

Are you sure you had the handbrake fully off when it felt a bit strange 1st time.
Bit of black smoke on start not unknown, see posts on "sooty calling card" Especially if you used the choke to restart when engine was already warm.
Don't worry too much give her a longer run and get up to full temperature and see how it goes, maybe after doing the plugs even if its just to boost your confidence.

[mrs.smith2012]

Thanks all, I’ll get under the bonnet tomorrow and have a good old check to see again if anything looks amiss. Do me good to familiarise myself with everything anyway!

Handbrake was definitely off, she felt weird when we got to the bottom of the hill, but I managed a 3 point turn in her with no issues, no hesitation or stalling, and she was fine driving back up to the lay-by we stopped in… she was also fine when we eventually got started she ran perfectly and got us home with no issues.

She’s been running fairly well, but needs a bit of tuning… I am working on that!

Good tip re the coil! Thanks!

[myoldjalopy]

Well, you would think a 'mechanic' would know not to leave the coil connected while he had the ignition on, but who knows these days
I wouldn't go replacing the coil just yet, unless it proves to be faulty, but a spare in the boot is good insurance. Make sure you get a good old, 'proper job' coil, many new ones are of poor quality.
Check/clean the plugs, go for a spin and all should be well - if not, at least you have hazard lights now!

[mrs.smith2012]

Well, you would think a 'mechanic' would know not to leave the coil connected while he had the ignition on, but who knows these days
I wouldn't go replacing the coil just yet, unless it proves to be faulty, but a spare in the boot is good insurance. Make sure you get a good old, 'proper job' coil, many new ones are of poor quality.
Check/clean the plugs, go for a spin and all should be well - if not, at least you have hazard lights now!

You would think! Tbh this chap came highly recommended through my local MMOC, not just a random person I found online, so in all likelihood it’s nothing to do with the coil although I will check and as suggested I will carry a spare. Nell did come with a box of spares so could be that I have one already! I shall check!
And yes like you said… any issues… at least I have hazard light now

[svenedin]

You say "clunky at the back" and "felt like she was dragging a bit". Is there any possibility that the handbrake was not fully released? This would have absolutely nothing to do with the auto electrician and purely coincidental.

Stephen

[mrs.smith2012]

You say "clunky at the back" and "felt like she was dragging a bit". Is there any possibility that the handbrake was not fully released?

Stephen

Someone suggested that, and I’m not completely discounting it, but I’m pretty sure handbrake was fully off. She drove a good distance with no issues, I just noticed as we got to the bottom of the hill she sounded a bit ‘off’ and felt a bit draggy. I’m probably not explaining very well. I did manage a 3 point turn in her, and we drove halfway back up the hill with no problems at all. It was only when we attempted a restart she was initially like ‘nah’
But she got us home fine so… maybe she was having a moment, but I will give her a bit more scrutiny tomorrow (weather permitting )

[moggiethouable]

It takes some time after a good run before the choke is needed again.
It takes time to get used to using a choke again, even for those of us old enough to consider themselves practiced in the art.
When the engine is warm after a run, try starting without choke, if she is lumpy then a little choke is required, if she starts ok and pulls away without kangarooing then dont bother with choke.
It is a feel that comes with time and practice.

[mrs.smith2012]

Thank you for the advice. Currently while I’m getting used to her (and a manual transmission) I’m only taking her on short drives to local places that I know so I suspect she’s not getting the chance to fully warm up before we get to our destination, so normally I’ll still have a little bit of choke on when we stop and I’ll leave it on when we restart… but I’ll experiment with maybe taking it right off before I start her again. It has been many many years since I used a choke so definitely need to get to grips with it again, her playing up yesterday could have been the simple fact of me not getting the choke right!
If this rain stops I’ll get her out for a run today… but not sure it’s going to

[mobylette]

Even after a short run and stop, always attempt the restart without choke. The engine will retain heat for some time.

[mrs.smith2012]

Even after a short run and stop, always attempt the restart without choke. The engine will retain heat for some time.

Really good to know, appreciate it

[geoberni]

"her ignition was on a fair bit while he was checking power etc"

It's possible that this may have caused the coil to overheat, leading to partial failure.

Agreed. If one of the coil's internal wires has become JUST disconnected, any heating or vibration can result in your intermittent symptoms.

As an electrician, who's initial training included piston engine ignition systems (Distributors and Magnetos), I have to disagree with that.
Any break in the internals of the Coil will result in instant cut out of the engine, it is either generating a spark multiple times a second, or it is Dead as a Dodo.
I also had a Coil problem with my car when I first got him, which I reported on here some years ago.
Even if it were 'loose' making and breaking, the engine would be cutting out and then picking up again, it certainly wouldn't be drivable.

Any 'electrical' fault with the Coil will result in the engine cutting out or really rough running if the spark is intermittently not there when it should be.
Other faults such as high resistance connections on the Low Tension side can result in weak spark, but a Coil can't have the sort of effect you're implying.

But thanks for posting the comment, as I'm doing a talk on Vehicle Electrics at our Branch meeting next month. You've given me something else to cover.