(DAMPNERS)To Upgrade or not to upgrade

[uclarge]

Hey guys, ive nearly cmpleted building sparky, went to "Woodies" my local moggie centre (near chichester) and bought the rest of the stuff i need for sparky my morris, right, as of such now im pretty skint from all the dosh ove spent building sparky but as soon as ive finished im planning to uprate my suspension to something a little more modern as sparky will be an everyday use car... so naturally id no from owning other moggies that suspension isnt like my corsa's i noticed on ESM's website they offer "spax telescopic dampner kit for front and back" which should technically make my ride alot more comfy! BUT! i have been a member of this website for a long time, and i have read sum unfortunate issues with these kits, but none o heard where the Spax kits, basically im not quite sure yet, the kit for front is only £139.00 and i guess same on back, and ill soon have the money for the conversion which ill do in my own time, what do you all believe??? i love sparky as he's a classic retro car, but he already is custmoised a bit! any ideas??? charly

[SR]

sounds good mate ,any pics?,steve

[uclarge]

yeh hundreds, i duno how to get them up like how you did yours!!!??? charly

[chickenjohn]

try changing the oil in the original dampers first, or possibly if the dampers are knackered, try replacing them. Its also often worth rebushing the suspension- surprising the difference this can make if the old rubbers are getting soft.

I would prefer to get a well sorted original car, which should ride nicely. IMHO, from the point of reliabillity for everyday use you are better off with an original car in good condition. As you've read, many of these mods cause more trouble than they are worth.

[jonathon]

There have been many remarks offered concerning modified suspension. There are only five producers of upgrade kits. C.Ware and the series111,C.s Autoclassics and their series1V, MMC Bath and the O.Burton kits, Spax's own kit and JLH stage one kits and coil overs and 5 link rear. I strongly recommend that you research this market thoroughly to avoid big disapointment. As John states a good condition and correctly set up minor can handle extreamly well on a standard Minor. An upgrade is beneficial if you are an enthusiastic driver or have more power than the original. Several posters on this forum have researched this market and it may well be that they PM you. There are very strong opinions on this topic so digest your info well and make your choice from a position of knowledge.

[bmcecosse]

I just added some tele dampers to the front suspension - and thicker oil in the standard rear dampers - and the result is fine for a road car. Nice soft but well damped suspension - which was Colin Chapman's 'secret' with his Lotus cars. Certainly the front suspension geometery is not all it could be - and as far as I can see even the coil kit doesn't sort this out, but it is more than adequate for a road car on sensible width tyres. And unless you have loads more power than standard - the standard rear axle set-up is fine for a road car. Better location would of course be highly desirable - but not necessary. Don't waste money - my tele dampaers for the front cost me 10 UKpds (sorry doing this in Canada and no pds sign on the keyboard !)

[Willie]

This is my twopennyworth! I noticed no improvement over good
condition standard front shockers on a standard Minor when I tried
telescopics. Rear telescopics were a definite improvement but you
need to buy a good name. What you must fit is a front anti-roll bar,
more improvement per pound than any of the other mods.

[Alec]

Hello Charly,
just a point that seems to cause a lot of confusion, dampers, commonly called shock absorbers, (which they are not), do not contribute to ride comfort at all, unless they are incorrectly rated or worn out. Spring rate and travel give comfort with the dampers keeping the springs in check.

Alec

[jonathon]

I'm afraid Bmecosse is doing the coil-over kit a dis-service yet again, although he doesn't specify whether he is talking about the MMC Bath kit or the JLH kit.
I can only speak with utmost authority about the JLH kit. and can inform you that this kit is adjustable for accurate camber,caster and KPI angles. My point yet again is that you should research your market thoroughly and rely on facts and not misguided opinion.

[Opus]

There have been many remarks offered concerning modified suspension. There are only five producers of upgrade kits. C.Ware and the series111,C.s Autoclassics and their series1V, MMC Bath and the O.Burton kits, Spax's own kit and JLH stage one kits and coil overs and 5 link rear. I strongly recommend that you research this market thoroughly to avoid big disapointment. As John states a good condition and correctly set up minor can handle extreamly well on a standard Minor. An upgrade is beneficial if you are an enthusiastic driver or have more power than the original. Several posters on this forum have researched this market and it may well be that they PM you. There are very strong opinions on this topic so digest your info well and make your choice from a position of knowledge.

[bigginger]

...and your point?
a

[bmcecosse]

I make no comment about individual kits - I am sure they are all excellent in their own way - my point is they are NOT necessary for road cars. Yes - adjustability is an excellent feature - but most on here don't know how to adjust the tracking, never mind all the other variables. If you are going on the track - go for the adjustable suspension ! If you want a nice riding road car - just ADD telescopic dampers front and back - but also keep the original dampers.

[Multiphonikks]

There have been many remarks offered concerning modified suspension. There are only five producers of upgrade kits. C.Ware and the series111,C.s Autoclassics and their series1V, MMC Bath and the O.Burton kits, Spax's own kit and JLH stage one kits and coil overs and 5 link rear. I strongly recommend that you research this market thoroughly to avoid big disapointment. As John states a good condition and correctly set up minor can handle extreamly well on a standard Minor. An upgrade is beneficial if you are an enthusiastic driver or have more power than the original. Several posters on this forum have researched this market and it may well be that they PM you. There are very strong opinions on this topic so digest your info well and make your choice from a position of knowledge.

[/quote

//Me presumes that was Someone from CS Autoclassics quoting Jonathon

Nikki

[bigginger]

Just wandered if they had a comment to add - or am I missing something?

[jonathon]

I think that the first port of call to make your minor handle better is to check the front end geometry. Its amazing just how little attention is given to this area. An overtightened tie bar,adjusted to take up the slack of a worn bush can alter the KPI and caster angles dramatically. Replacement chassis legs poorly fitted or patched legs can throw out your camber angle. There are not too many centers who are willing to spend the time on properly set up minors. In my area they just cannot be bothered so most of our cars go to a local race car specialist, and the diference is amazing. With the coil-over kit and 5 link kit, the corner weights can also be set, again the difference this makes is tangeble.
For those who may be considering the coil over route, I quote Classic Car Marts report by the respected Rod Kerr.
"Luckily for everyone, with all the suspension,brakes and chassis mods, this car feels entirely differenton the road. Generally speaking, the impressionis that you're driving something bigger, lower and more stable.....There's loads of feedback andyou can tell exactly what's happening at the road surface. Instead of a slightly wandery sensation,caused at least partly I reckon by the amount of compliance in the standard suspension, there's a feeling of rock-solid stability. I accidently chose to drive down what must be one of the bumpiest roads in Warwickshire, but Top Cat didn't show any tendency to lurch off into the hedgerows......In a moment of glory, it was here that I managed to catch up with a large Mercedes, which evidently find the going so easy."

I offer this quote as a counter to those who are prepared to disregard the kit as a pure track application. Rod Ker is only one of a large number of respected journalists who have had the experience of this specific kit/set up, I suggest that those vocal in disregarding this kit, do as the jornalists have done, try it, then you have the right to talk about it.
I do not intend this post as an overt advert for my products ,but an informed defence, against undeserved comments.

[les]

but most on here don't know how to adjust the tracking, never mind all the other variables

But us lesser beings could probably find someone who does! One advantage, to my mind is that coil-overs replace several components and spread the load on the chassis, not that I have so far got any complaints with the original set up. I have seen the jlh kit and it looked well made.

[jonathon]

Spot on Les!!!

[Kevin]

If you want a nice riding road car - just ADD telescopic dampers front and back - but also keep the original dampers.

Sorry to be a bit late onto this one but I have never seen teles and levers together on the rear of a Moggie are you sure.

[bmcecosse]

Yep - I did it 40 years ago on my rally Minor !!

[Kevin]

Where did the tele`s fit and how if the rear levers were retained.