ESM Hubs

[Deaconbrody]

I have a Morris Minor Convertible with Marina disc brakes and Marina back axle fitted.

The car is fitted with Marina wheels.

My question is. If I buy two of the Marina hubs, part No. DSK104, from ESM spares that can be fitted to the Minor stub axles without the, 'Top Hat', adaptors. Can the PCD be changed from 4" to 3.75" PCD, and what is the best way to do this?

Also, do the studs have to be changed on the DSK104 hubs? Is there a difference between the Marina studs and the minor studs? Thicker, longer, etc.

Thanks for your help,

Ian.

[philthehill]

https://www.morrisminorspares.com/brake ... al-p829471

I would suggest that what you have is the best option.
Why go the long way round to get back to where you started?
There is nothing wrong with the top hat spacer if fitted correctly.
My Ser 2 had a similar set up and Minor 1000 had the same set up and both covered many miles without problem.
The Marina and Minor studs are different and cannot just be interchanged.

[Deaconbrody]

Hi Phil,

Thanks for your reply. It was just when I asked ESM for top hat adaptors the man said they were not supplying these anymore and did not recommend them for use. Although I did get 2.

So I thought perhaps it would be better to fit parts that did not require modification, i.e. DSK104 hubs. Although I suppose I am contradicting myself as the hubs would require modification!

Perhaps thinking too much.

Ian

[philthehill]

Ian
Thanks for the reply and explanation.
ESM inherited the remaining stock of top hat spacers when they purchased the Morris parts from Bull Motif.
Whilst I would not go down the top hat spacer route if I was currently starting out again as there are other options to consider but the top hat spacer was and still is a useful means of getting the Marina disk brake set up onto a Minor. Originally there were no other off the shelf options available.
I managed to get four of the top hat spacers off ESM for my back up parts stock as I still need the top hat spacer even though I have gone the whole hog and fitted Marina stub axles because the Marina hub seal has a different I.D. to the Morris hub seal.

Phil

[Deaconbrody]

Hi Phil,

I have two Marina stub axles I managed to buy on ebay, so may get these fitted to two minor uprights for use if I have problems in the future.

You are right, my Marina modified disc brakes and stub axles are operating fine, and I have had no problems with them over the past 6 years. I suppose I am always thinking of 'what if' scenarios for the future. Also, too much time to think during Covid lockdown!

I must admit I like to buy parts that I think may get scarcer in the future. Have a couple of Marina half shafts and rear hubs that were not too expensive off of ebay.

Anyway, as always thanks for your excellent advice.

Ian

[Steve Phillips]

In the good old days.......
We would pitch 4 new stud holes in our original marina hubs to convert them from 3 3/4" pcd to 4" pcd or 4 1/4" pcd so if the esm hubs are cast exactly the same as the OE marina hubs it should be possible,

All you need are marina appropriate studs (have a look at grayston engineering for the studs) and a friendly engineer with an accurate milling machine,

Steve.

[Deaconbrody]

Thanks Steve,

Just covering all my options. It really concerns me that these mods that are carried out to Minors, are getting scarcer all the time. Better to be prepared.

Ian

[philthehill]

This is the Grumpys way of rearranging the wheel stud PCD to suit the Minor PCD in a Marina hub.
The hole is first blanked with a top hat plug and the new PCD drilled to suit and new studs fitted.
I have to say - it is not as easy as just drilling a new hole and fitting new studs.

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[RobThomas]

I asked ESM if they could supply 2 hubs with 4.5 inch PCD or just blank.

No reply.

[smithskids]

I did my traveler that way in 1995 then transferred them to my tourer in 1997 when I sold the trav. I think I drilled them 5/8" whit then re tapped them in the same way as you describe, the are still ok.

[Deaconbrody]

Hi Rob,

I sent a message to ESM spares, and ESM workshop asking if they could modify their Marina hubs with 4" PCD to 3.75" PCD with Marina Studs. Same as you, no reply. I think they are missing out on a nice earner, as there must be lots of people would like the Marina hubs with different PCDs. Also just heard today Charles Ware are no longer doing the top hat adaptor for the Marina hubs. I suppose I could just buy two Marina hubs, and have them converted in a mechanical workshop.

Ian

[Deaconbrody]

Just thinking, perhaps we have not heard from ESM due to the Corona Virus lockdown. Hopefully they will reply soon. Ian.

[philthehill]

Why would you buy two Marina hubs which are already at 3.75" PCD. and then want them converted to 3.75" PCD?

I do not see the logic in you train of thought!

Do you mean purchase two ESM hubs for Marina disc brakes and have them converted back to 3.75" PCD. Again why reinvent the wheel or hub in this case.

[Deaconbrody]

Hi Phil,

Sorry, perhaps my logic is flawed. I believe ESM supply new machined hubs that are manufactured to fit the Minor stub axles for the Marina disc brake conversion without the top hat adaptor. These hubs are fitted with Minor studs on a 4" PCD to accept Minor wheels.

My car has Marina wheels with 3.75" PCD. My logic was if the ESM hubs supplied above had Marina studs fitted on a 3.75" PCD they would fit my car fitted with standard Minor stub axles without the need for the top hat adaptor.

ESM also supply the bearings for these adapted hubs to fit the Minor stub axles.

Perhaps I am starting to confuse myself on this one!

Ian

[philthehill]

You are not confusing yourself but you are making a lot of unnecessary work for yourself .
The top hat spacers are perfectly serviceable and will last a long time. I suspect that top hat spacers are already fitted to the stubs on your Minor, also you have obtained a spare set as well.
If the top hat spacers will stand the extreme loading as experienced with my comp Minor I would suggest that for normal road use they will last a long time.
The only reason I fitted the Marina stub axles in place of the Minor stub axles was the extreme loading on the stub axle and not the loading on the top hat spacer. I still need the top hat spacer (slightly modified) for the Marina hub seal.

[Deaconbrody]

Hi Phil,

Thanks once again for your practical, and down to earth advice. The one thing that has come out of all this is, I now know exactly what is going on, and the parts involved regarding my front steering and braking system. I will step back from my Marina hub idea, and just enjoy driving the car!

All the best,

Ian