Alternator

[surfergirl]

Hey guys,
I know this has been covered alot but would value any opinions on swapping from the old dyno to an alternator kit maybe from Bullmotif. I need to fit some fog lights as we get a lot of summer fog in Cornwall (liquid sunshine!) and with the blower and wipers reckon the extra ump from an alternator would help.
Any dos and donts would help.
Thanks.

[panky]

I got this one

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MORRIS-MINOR- ... 27ecbea2bb

It's actually come down in price since I bought it. Two years on and no problems
Took less than an hour to fit and just needed a longer bolt on one end of the bracket and a couple of washers to line the pulleys up. Your van must be negative earth of course.

[mogbob]

Lots of opinions on the Forum.
If your wiring loom is " still fit for purpose " I'd go for an alternator kit .There is also the " sticky " available to consult on here when doing the conversion.
I reckon that the dynamo can cope in a well maintained car , good battery, etc and the car getting a good run on a regular basis. In the winter ( has that arrived already ? ) every thing switched on, short runs, the dynamo struggles to keep up.
Great if you like living on the edge , will it start or won't it , now I've scraped the ice off !
Most people like being able to jump in the car , twist the key and go. The manufacturers switched to an alternator , it wasn't on a whim.

Extra lights ( front and rear ? )to cope with the Fog.
Install with relays as a minimum , in line fuses , thicker wires ,a warning light to remind you that they are on ? Note the requirements , position on the car , wiring regs for operation, etc.
Others will be along with their take on things.
From a Devonian with a Cornish surname. Proper job.
Bob

[surfergirl]

Thanks,
short journeys at the mo. Im afraid, not good for it I know. Had a longer run today to St.Michaels Mount to check the surf, started to misfire on the way home. Turned out to be a loose wire on the distributor, always adds excitement to any trip!.
Fitted a new battery few weeks ago, wiring isnt too bad, many years ago a short in the fog light nearly fried the van with smoke coming from the oddment box behind the wheel, so took the light off and never got round to fitting a new one.
We get sooo much fog here.

[myoldjalopy]

Thass St Just for 'ee!

[bmcecosse]

You don't need an alternator to fit a couple of rear fog warning lights - and front 'fog' lights are a waste of time/money/effort anyway.Make sure the fan belt is snug and the dynamo will cope well.

[surfergirl]

Thanks,
True enough, not for a couple of fog lights, but heater, halogen lights, wipers all adds up. Any hooo would be good to keep updating where one can?!.
Also with the economy going down again, may well be the only daily transport I have in the future ( part from push bike, but cant get long board on it!)

[Trickydicky]

If your only doing short journeys then an alternator is a good upgrade as the battery will charge across the whole rev range. As for halogen headlights, they are still the same wattage so will draw the same amount of current as standard headlights.
Personally I would upgrade as it's an easy swap over and you can fit and forget it.

[oliver90owner]

Many do not realise that modern automotive battery design assumes a surplus of generation at almost all times the engine is operating. Discharging, what is basically a starting device, to any great extent will seriously reduce the battery life. They only have a certain number of full discharge cycles (and multiple part-discharges are additive towards this number of full discharges) before becoming worn out.

Think here that a battery left on float charge would likely easily still work after eight, maybe ten, years. Whereas that same battery taken to 50% depth of discharge every day, before fully reharging, would likely not last a year.

So, what should happen is that a few hundred amps are consumed by the starter motor for very few seconds and this small battery discharge is replaced over the first minutes of engine running. Running with a charging deficit will inevitably lead to shortened battery life.

Pay back, to fit an alternator of adequate capacity, may not be so long. New batteries are not a cheap item.

[Corn22]

I fitted the kit from ESM earlier this year and it works really well. I have front spot lights and a rear fog light. I intend to fit a few more extras over time to help with the lovely fog and rain we get down here

[bmcecosse]

Your dynamo should easily cope with the electrical equipment you describe. Assuming you run the engine for at least 10 minutes from each cold start. But if you can pick up an alternator cheaply enough - by all means go for it. Note the car must be negative earth. If buying 'new' - there is one Company perhaps best to avoid - see other threads on the subject..... Don't worry about the 'economy' - it's going to boom - and more people will be holidaying in Britain if the exchange rates stay low. So more 'surfing' business !!

[surfergirl]

Thanks,
That company wouldnt be something to do with bull would it?

They reckon the southwest is always in recession so one more shouldnt make too much difference.

[MikeNash]

A few thoughts.
I've run a pair of fog lights AND two spot lights for years using just the dynamo, the spots being wired directly in with the main beams (so that all four come on together when the dipswitch is pressed) and with the two fogs wired separately through their own dedicated switch. All bulbs are modern halogen (55 watters - I think that's right) and on main beam the lights are better than on our 2015 Peugeot 5008. Unlike Roy, I find the fog lights are very useful in the narrow lanes we have around here especially those in the "Hampshire Highlands" that rise behind us to almost a 1000 ft and which often suffer from low cloud in the winter. I've angled the fogs so they spread across the lane to show both sides - and at the moment that's lots of overhanging cow parsley!

All of these lights are controlled by the existing switches i.e. the "pull" type and the standard dipswitch and with an extra "pull" for the fog lights. None of these switches have shown signs of any distress over the years even when passing the higher current for hours at a time. With the all the lights on, my ammeter showed that at speed, i.e. above 40 mph, all is just balanced, so with just the two fogs, as you intend, you'll have charge to spare if you're moving above, say, about 30mph.

So my advice to you is to just fit your fog lights and see how you get on; I doubt if you need an alternator quite yet. BUT if you retain your dynamo I do STRONGLY recommend that you fit an ammeter and then you'll always be aware when you need to "dump" the extra load i.e. when you've got a persistent and excessive discharge that you don't think's appropriate at the time and conditions. (Of the common extra instruments the oil pressure gauge is often considered most important but I've found the ammeter as by far the most "useful"!)

Regards, MikeN.

PS And, of course, once you've fixed your design please follow Mogbob's advice and use relays, not like me a born bodger who never gets around to doing it properly.

[surfergirl]

Thanks for the replies,
Sounds good fitting rear fogs and an ammeter, thinks Ive got one somewhere. So the relays do what in the fog light wiring?

If I dont fit an Alternator may use the money for electronic distributor, which may get rid of recurring misfire.

[bmcecosse]

Nothing to do with Bulls. You don't need a relay for rear fog warnings (and many new cars these days only have ONE - on the offside - perfectly legal. Note if you fit rear fog warnings they become MOTable and must work, and must have a warning light, and only work when headlights are on ..... I'm sure your 'fog' is what we would call 'harr' and usually disperses quickly as the sun rises. Is it really such a hazard for you ??

[surfergirl]

You need to holiday near Lands End! We get wet fog, dry fog, sunny fog, windy fog, fog over high ground, fog only at sea level and this is in the summer!
What makes it interesting is narrow lanes with coaches that would normally drive on motorways in other countries. The tiny round back lights on the van are like two candles, as the grill of a autobahn coach fills the rear view and nearly squashes you into a granite hedge.! While happy tourists film through the sun roof to show their friends back home.
Any hoo.

[mogbob]

There are a couple of You Tube short videos produced by Moss Motors Ltd 1.Relays - How they work and 2 Relays -How to wire.

I've used http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk for many years ( satisfied customer ) for auto wiring /relays/ parts etc.
There are other reputable suppliers of course.

Bob

[surfergirl]

Cool, thanks I will have a look.
Clutch went today on my other van (LDV Sherpa) so that will soak up time and funds.!

[bmcecosse]

All you need for a rear fog is a feed from the headlight switch - a fuse - a switch with a warning light, and a rear fog lamp on the offside. Simples!

[MikeNash]

Also Maplin, if you've one nearby, for 12 volt relays. I've found the staff knowledgeable - at least here in Andover.
Regards, MikeN.
PS Let us know how you get on.