Seized Brakes

[LUR759H]

you can buy all the brake pipe kit as in copper pipes from front to rear axle for 20£ on ebay thats what i did not fitted mine yet but have them ready!

Alan

Im glad you have nice drums they look as though they might clean up fine....

[bmcecosse]

DO NOT use 'copper' piping for brakes ! But I agree with the point that you can buy sets of pipes 'ready made' so the job won't be all that difficult. I would certainly renew the 3 flexible pipes - but the solid pipes may be ok if they have been 'dry' and/or covered in oil leakage! Well done getting that drum off - you have the idea now... The cylinder may still be seized internally - the handbrake piston is external but the hydraulic piston is internal.

[svenedin]

I've got the other rear one off now. Just as difficult. A real fight. This one had a cylinder that had been leaking. I'll clean up the backplates and unions tonight ready to install new cylinders, brake shoes and flexible pipes tomorrow. I had a complete set of Ferodo brake shoes in the boot of the car. I checked the master cylinder. There is brake fluid in it but it looks nasty and murky. Is there a way of purging the system of the filthy old brake fluid before putting new in? Getting the master cylinder out for overhaul or replacement looks quite a task.

I hope the front ones are easier! I'm thinking they shouldn't be seized on but the cylinders will probably still be seized.

[bmcecosse]

Just let the old fluid run away..then flush it through with some new fluid.

[svenedin]

I got the brake shoes out of one side. I left the other side for reference. I noted the leading edge of the top shoe facing towards the front and the bottom shoe the other way around. I disconnected the brake pipe, bleed nipple and banjo bolt and banjo but I had terrible trouble trying to disconnect the handbrake. I couldn't get the split pin out (I really really hate split pins). Eventually both ends of the split pin snapped off leaving nothing to grab hold of but just enough to stop the clevis pin from coming out. Infuriating for the sake of a corroded split pin. I think I have no option but to hacksaw off the split pin end of the clevis pin, push it out and get a new one. Or maybe I'll drill it till the walls of the pin are very thin and crush it (that would satisfying). I checked the action of the brake pedal (which wouldn't move) with the brake line disconnected and it moved fine with fluid flowing out of the brake line.

What other maintenance jobs should I do with the wheels and drums off?

[LUR759H]

why not check the bushes on the springs while the wheel is not there...

Alan

[mike.perry]

Did you manage to slacken the adjusters before tryng to remove the rear drums?
Try filing off the end of the split pin
Whilst the back wheels are off top up the rear dampers
Let us know when you start reassembling the back brakes
Are you replacing the handbrake cables?.
The front pistons should be siezed off so it should be easier to remove the drums. Remember there are two adjusters each side at the front
For the following operation you will need to remove one drum at a time and you will need someone to push the brake pedal whilst you watch the pistons
If you have any pressure in the system, with one drum removed press the brake pedal and watch to see if the pistons move. If only one piston moves clamp it and push harder on the pedal and hopefully the other will pop out.
Clamp both pistons and repeat on the other side
.

[svenedin]

No, I could not get the drums to rotate at all so there was no way to access the adjusters. I tried filing the tiny bit of split pin but access is so poor that I gave up as my leg had gone numb and my knees were hurting!

[LUR759H]

Can you explain why DO NOT use 'copper' fo brakes ! because I already buy/bye? from ebay...

Alan

DO NOT use 'copper' piping for brakes ! But I agree with the point that you can buy sets of pipes 'ready made' so the job won't be all that difficult. I would certainly renew the 3 flexible pipes - but the solid pipes may be ok if they have been 'dry' and/or covered in oil leakage! Well done getting that drum off - you have the idea now... The cylinder may still be seized internally - the handbrake piston is external but the hydraulic piston is internal.

[tysonn]

Roy doesn't like copper brake pipes because its softer than steel or kunifer and thought by some to go brittle.Having said that one of my cars had copper pipes fitted 12 years ago and they're still going strong!

[kennatt]

if you are going to the trouble of taking off the master cylinder,not a simple job,I would get a new one instead of refurbing,and then forget about it . They invariably start to leak after a refurb,they are usually rusted /damaged inside and after a short while the new rubber seals get damaged,so.................out it has to come again to renew.Not cheap but a better plan if you can afford it.

[bmcecosse]

Hmmm -see a nearby thread where a 'new' master cylinder leaked after a few months...

[svenedin]

Yes. I will renew the master cylinder. This job is going to have to be spread over a few weeks. As elsewhere on the car, one job leads to many others. I have cleaned up all the brake parts and have found that the bleed nipple thread is badly corroded so needs replacing and the rubber bushes on the leaf springs look terrible as well. I have ordered a Kunifer brake pipe kit from Automec and some silicone brake fluid. I know silicone brake fluid is a moot point but this car is not likely to be used much and will sit for weeks between outings so I can't be doing renewing seized cylinders every five minutes. I have other things to do (like my job)....Are the polyurethane bushes recommended? I think I may as well do the half shaft seals and handbrake cable (frayed) while I'm here too. Leaf springs look OK. Surface rust but sound underneath. There's no point me doing one job and then taking the same bits off again to do another.

Getting the rear cylinder out was a bit tricky. Looked like it couldn't possibly come out until I realised that it could be "persuaded" to pop out sideways after getting it free through the backplate at the top. Still almost no clearance at all.

Oh, I suppose I ought to service the dampers as well...

Diff is leaking from breather, drain and at the front too!

[LUR759H]

new master on ebay for about 72£ item number 290817634807 id be intrested to see how you get on as this is a job i may need to do.

Alan

[svenedin]

ESM has a master cylinder for £49.50. I'll report back but it'll be several weeks before I get to do it.

[bmcecosse]

Yes - use poly bushes - and drain/refill the dampers with sae 40 oil. Are the bump stops present/correct ?

[svenedin]

The big piece of rubber above the leaf springs? Yes look good but dirty. Inner wings also look good except rust proof coating has come off in a few places. Seems only surface rust and sound. However, as 20 years ago car does not like axle stands. Door don't shut but I think it is asjustment rather than chassis flex

[LUR759H]

ESM has a master cylinder for £49.50. I'll report back but it'll be several weeks before I get to do it.

Thanks svenedin,

Thats a really good price Ive been looking hence my ebay quote, Ill be calling ESM...

BMC, The SAE OLI you make mention off / of (not sure which of / off is right for English) where do I put it in the dampers? I have two replacement dampers to go on but they seem a lot more springy and bouncy than the old ones on the car.

Alan

[bmcecosse]

There is a drain plug in the base - take that out carefully, because the valving is attached ! The fill plug is on top - remove that too - add the SAE 40 (that's NOT 10W40...) in the top and gently move the arm full stroke end to end to pump out the old oil and slowly replace it with new. Dampers should never be 'springy'!! Their purpose in life is to absorb energy - where a spring does the opposite - by kicking the energy back at you!

[LUR759H]

If the dampers is springy will the oil change them? or are they no good, should I keep my old ones whichare very corroded and rusty and less springy?

Alan