Brakes...

[kennatt]

indeed roy, thats why I asked what the fault was,if you can pump and get a hard pedal then 99% of the time the fault is poor adjustment very rarely air in the system. If you have a lot of air in the system all the pumping in the world will not produce a hard pedal.

[Trickydicky]

From the first post he did actually say he had replaced various brake parts, granted they could be out of adjustment but the symptoms he describes could point to air in the system.

[kennatt]

yes but he says he gets a hard pedal after pumping,indicating adjustment.

[bmcecosse]

I agree - air tends to give a sinking feeling............

[ben-me-123]

Just tried the adjusting etc... all seems pretty good now.... I adjusted and let gravity do it for me... then drove about 30 something miles last night- everything alright and again today going round the countryside. There wasn't fluid in the chassis leg .. . I didn't even think of adjustment etc.... which I should... Thanks to you all, now I can enjoy the good weather.

[lambrettalad]

result it's so nice to get feedback

[bmcecosse]

Well done - you pretty much need to keep 'on top' of the adjustment if using the brakes hard...

[ben-me-123]

it's only when you talk to other people that you do something you'd advise someone else to do... trying to be too clever...

[oilypaws]

Interesting reading this as my brakes have been a little difficult too.

I found bleeding them to be very easy (by myself) - just used a 1-man bleeder kit which is a little bottle that magnets onto the drum and has a pipe going to the bleed nipple. Inside the bottle the pipe goes to the bottom so that it forms an airlock once there is some fluid in there. Starting with air in all the lines, about 4 presses on the pedal had clean fluid coming out at each wheel cylinder (topping up MC each time of course). I then went around them all and gave another 4 pumps for each wheel just to be sure, but got only clean fluid (you can see bubbles in the pipe to the bottle if there is air). No special method is required in pumping the pedal, so long as it is all set up right - just smooth pumps. The fluid in the bottle stops air going back in.

I note that the brake springs (all new) don't seem to pull the shoes back in immediately if the adjustment is too loose, so the first press of the pedal is too long but then the second press is firm. On leaving them for a minute or so they creep back, so it's back to a long pedal travel on the first press (as mentioned above).

So I've figured all that out, and they seem to be working OK. However, if I hit the brakes hard, the car pulls a little to the right and then the back right wheel locks up first. Something is uneven, but it seems too pronounced to be the rear brakes. I don't know what to do as the drums have all been ground and have oversized shoes fitted which were made up for each drum. All wheel cylinders are also new so it's basically a new system. How does one deal with uneven brakes?

Also, could it be that the front dampers are not even, so when the front dips under sudden braking one side is dipping more?

I need to find someone with a 'rolling road' brake tester to get some actual numbers for the brakes, I guess.

[bmcecosse]

It will be a sticky/seized LEFT rear cylinder. And nothing to do with the dampers.........

[MarkyB]

Replace whatever liquid is in the front dampers with 20/50 engine oil or something thicker.
The back brakes must be adjusted using the adjusters first, then balance/adjust the handbrake using the cable adjusters.

[bmcecosse]

20/50 is no use (well - it will be slightly better than horrible old smelly/thin oil that has been in the dampers since the dawn of time....)- needs to be straight oil , 40 or 50 grade if possible, SAE 30 at a pinch........

[MarkyB]

Not at all. it will be a vast improvement on anything that's in there and should be readily available.
My guess is that one of them is going to leak badly anyway.

[oilypaws]

Hmm, this is turning into a damper thread instead!

I actually drained, flushed and refilled them already. I used 10W/30 because that was the thickest oil I could find (maybe I should try some chainsaw bar lube...!). One was empty, and (surprise surprise) that one leaked after I put it back on. So I replaced it with another second hand one (also with fresh oil).

No leaks now, and both feel stiff (ie. plenty of damping). However the replacement one seemed a little softer than the other one, although it's hard to tell by hand. It looked like it might have been rebuilt or adjusted internally - the crimp on the valve thingee looked a bit different. So I'm thinking they may be uneven. The question is, could this produce the apparent brake problem (I.e. a dip to one side). If it did, it could unload one rear wheel a bit and hence produce the right side rear lockup. The dodgy shock is on the front left.

Anyway it's up on the stands now so I'll be going over the brakes again. It's just done 1600 miles, so it should be obvious from wear marks if one brake shoe isn't working or something like that (or, worst case, oil is leaking onto the linings).

It's all part of the fun, I guess!

[bmcecosse]

No - nothing to do with the braking. You have a seized cylinder..... 10W30 is too thin in the dampers - even thinner than the original which was SAE 20 grade.. Get the 'thicker' oil - you can get SAE 30 in the garden section at DIY places. Otherwise ebay for SAE 40 or 50 - or a motor bike place....where they will try to flog you 'fork oil' at great cost. Motor oil is fine.

[oilypaws]

Well, after removing the drums I found that all drums and shoes are showing signs of use (drums were ground and shoes replaced 1600 miles ago). All wheel cylinders are free and working fine. The adjustments could have been a little tighter though. Next step is taking it to someone who has a proper brake test setup (roller-style) to get actual numbers and see if it really is the brakes. May have to try thicker oil in the shocks Although I must say they feel fine - You can feel them working on the bumps and the car doesn't wallow or bounce.

[bmcecosse]

Swap the shoes and drums around and try again to see if it has a better balance. It's not the dampers....