Problems with refitting 948/1098 style oil cannister

[gtt1951]

Today I did an oil and filter change. First, I made sure that the sump drain plug and the cannister centre bolt could be loosened!
I ran the engine up to what I thought was "running temperature" (not having a temp gauge, at the moment, doesn't help).
I added Wynns Engine Flush and ran the engine, at raised revs, for the 15 mins stated on the can (I use their Diesel version on my Piggot - but that needs 20 mins running time).
I drained the sump - something went "clunk" into the large aluminium tray I use for oil collection (heart sank a bit). Later, I had to run my (gloved) hand through the black oil, slowly, to find what it was I lost - I assumed it must be the copper washer, as there wasn't one on the recovered sump plug ... it was! That is when I realised that the engine oil wasn't as hot as the stuff that comes out of my Piggot, as I was able to get my hand in the tray.
Next came the undoing of the long bolt, from the oil container - this can only be removed from underneath the car - Oh my back!
The "can" is made of aluminium, hence why I couldn't attach my ex-HDD magnet - I'm sure my old 1964 Saloon had a steel can.
I knew that there would be components that needed to be reused, so I was very careful in making sure nothing else fell into the tray.
When the felt filter was removed, I noted that the large steel flange/washer was on top of the filter, rather than underneath it and being used to press the filter up by the spring.
After cleaning everything up, and then reassembling the filter can correctly (and filling it part way with fresh oil), I tried to re-attach it to the car.
Could I manage this? Like heck I could! You need to be Charles Atlas to have the strength, whilst lying on your back, to press the cannister up, against the force of the internal spring, to anywhere near enough to then use your other hand (with ratchet socket tool) to try to do up the bolt.
After losing some of the oil contents of the cannister and multiple attempts, I gave up and fitted it the way that the previous oil changer had done. This means that the filter will not be functioning correctly as some of the oil can bypass the filter with the gaps it now has.
What is the correct method of trying to get this assembly back in place?
Have I purchased a filter that is too long for the cannister (I got mine from Camberley Autofactors)?
Hope someone on this forum can shed some light on this procedure.
Best regards, George.

[bmcecosse]

The way you have fitted it is ABSOLUTELY USELESS.... It is not doing ANY filtering at all - you may as well have not bothered puting a filter in. You will need to take it out and do the job properly. It's really NOT that hard to push it up and engage the thread. Don't worry about filling with oil - you can do that by spinning the engine with the plugs out. Hope you removed the old rubber ring from the top casing - and fitted a new one, held in with a wipe of grease.

[DAVIDMCCULLOUGH]

I have found the aluminium filter housing slightly harder to fit than the steel ones, but it should still be possible to get it into place. What way up did you have the steel washer as it could potentially hold it down by about 1/4'

[mike.perry]

I never change the rubber O ring. If it don't leak, leave it

[gtt1951]

BMC, I know that it isn't doing a filtering job, but there is no way that I could get this blessed thing connected correctly.
It is VERY difficult to try to get the assembly compressed enough to then do up the bolt.
The only way I can envisage getting this fitted is if someone else gets to pull the can up (from under the bonnet) whilst the fitter gets to do up the bolt from underneath.
If there isn't a problem in fitting this, then I must have an over-length filter element.
Please note that the previous element changer had exactly the same problem!
I do not remember this being a problem back in 1978, when I last did an oil change on my old 1964 saloon.

[bmcecosse]

I doubt it's an over long filter - but do compare with the old filter. Also - if the plate has a concave section - make sure it is fitted right way round. Best way is to put socket and ratchet on the bolt and then push up and turn the ratchet to engage the thread. Once it's started - you can align the can with the top before it finally seats. You may want to consider swapping to a screw on filter since you are having so much trouble - but you can't leave it with no filtering - it's the major cause of A series engine failure....

[gtt1951]

BMC, I had to put the can back on, the wrong way, as it was starting to rain and I needed to get the car covered again. It isn't going anywhere, at the moment, and I will get an extra pair of hands to help me refit it correctly.
What worries me is how long the previous filter had been in the wrong way and how many miles it had done like that?
There wasn't too much crud in the bottom of the can.
I didn't measure the filters - I still can but, obviuosly, the previous filter changer had the same problem (so both must be the same length.
Maybe the spring is too long (or too tough). I did assemble the concave plate the correct way round (or did I?).
Anyway, I'll have another go this weekend (if dry).

[bmcecosse]

Good luck! And yes - the worry is how long has there been no filtering.

[philthehill]

If you decide to fit the screw on canister oil filter head you can if you want to use the longer (13cm) Ford screw on oil filter i.e. FRAM Part No: PH5210. The more filter the more crud it will catch. To compliment the oil filter use the ESM magnetic oil sump drain plug Part No: 10M247A.

[gtt1951]

I think I know what I may have done wrong I may have put the large support washer in the wrong way round, thus giving the filter additional "lift". I won't know now until I get a chance to remove and refit on a dry sunny day with a "helper" to hand, if need be
What it is to confuse "concave" with "convex"

[bmcecosse]

That was what I was suggesting......

[lambrettalad]

spin on filter conversion is very simple relatively cheap and is pretty problem free and easy to obtain the filters (mini ones fit ).Plus kwik fit and their ilk will change your oil for you (you supply the oil) if you have not got the facilities at you disposal.

[rayofleamington]

What it is to confuse "concave" with "convex

the middle 'dished' part of the washer should fit into the end of the filter, which will help to keep the filter centralised.
Fitting the big dished washer the wrong way round is exactly what I thought you'd have done based on the description.

The only other optionsI can think of are:
Filter too long (not heard of that ever before)
Wrong spring (anything is possible if the previous servicer was a numpty and lost the spring so put something else in instead)

As for conversion to spin on... most get away with it with no big issues, but for the unlucky ones I've heard of all kinds of problems, e.g.wasting a couple of days because it didn't fit properly, e.g. broken studs .e.g. gaskets not right e.g. leaks.

Once you've sorted out the original filter assembly once, you'll not have a problem doing it every time. If it has the benefit of a filter blocked warning light sensor it's already better than a spin on unit.

whichever solution you end up with, you are best advised to replace the filter again after a hundred miles / 1 long hard run! As the engine has not been filtering well for a while you run the risk of getting a blocked filter when you sort it. I had this once on a 1275 engine that I'd just fitted to a minor saloon. The 1275 didn't have the filter blocked warning sensor so After 3 weeks of running 120 miles per week the first I knew of a problem was the big ends giving up
Previous owner of the engine (in a Minor van) was a total numpty, and the non-filtering wasn't the only thing they'd done wrong. That was a hard lesson to learn as a pennyless 20 yr old!

ps. my modern car has a separate can with replacement element - not really so different from the Minor (apart from being above the engine instead of at the bottom).

[JOWETTJAVELIN]

Ray, was that a Midget 1275 engine? I ask because I know for sure that Marina engines have the disposable cartridge type fitted, just wondering if the Midget engine had the earlier filter.

[bmcecosse]

Yes - the Spridget 1275 engine has the proper filter - which is how it is identified!

[lambrettalad]

quote
"As for conversion to spin on... most get away with it "..........Ray of Leamington

All bits have problems after all theses answers are dealing with a non spin on problem

[philthehill]

I have just stripped a late MG midget 1275cc engine for rebuild and it was fitted with a canister filter and a raiser block between the engine block and filter head. I assume the raiser block was to allow the filter to clear the chassis leg. Earlier 1275 midget blocks appear to have the 'proper' filter and no raiser block.

[JOWETTJAVELIN]

Yes - the Spridget 1275 engine has the proper filter - which is how it is identified!

Thanks.

[bmcecosse]

Let's see a picture of the raiser block Phil???

[JOWETTJAVELIN]

Though quite what is meant by 'proper' filter I don't know - they both do the same job. Seems a relic of the post-war sidevalve days if you ask me.

The disposable cartridge filter is arguably better it being more or less foolproof.