London Low Emission Zone

[Matt]

Heres a challenging question for you guys in London...

I have an N reg transit which is not LEZ compliant, however TFL will give you 28 days grace from the first time the vehicle is seen inside the LEZ to bring it to standard (via a warning letter http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/lez/177 ... #container)

I bought this van just after the LEZ came in to force (~15th Jan this year) and I need to go inside the zone with it for 2 days as a one off. (I also have a petrol one which is compliant which will would normally do the task but its having bodywork done)

Is there any way to find out if the warning letter has already been issued for a vehicle?

Thanks!

[MarkyB]

As you haven't been sent one I'd say you should be fine.
How could they hold you responible for a letter sent to someone else?

[Matt]

ahh yes, but it doesn't work like that. Each vehicle gets 1 letter - if the owner changes tough luck!

I don't know how it would be affected by registration no. change though?

[MarkyB]

Ask them then.
I don't see how else you can cover yourself if you don't have to have been sent the letter.
How they would try and defend this stance in court is beyond me.

[LouiseM]

As the TFL site states:

We may issue a Penalty Charge Notice if you drive within the Low Emission Zone without meeting emissions standards, or paying the daily charge

You can drive a vehicle that doesn't meet the emissions standards within the LEZ providing that you pay the daily charge. If the previous owner was subject to a penalty notice the first time the vehicle was driven within the zone he would have been given 28 days to either make the vehicle emissions compliant (which he obviously didn't) or to pay the daily charge.

If you decide not to pay the daily charge, best case scenario is that you'll get a warning letter and 28 days to pay it. Worse case scenario is that you'll get a large penalty to pay on top of the daily charge. Either way you'll end up having to pay the daily charge so safest thing to do is just pay it in the first place to avoid getting a penalty notice.

[Matt]

If the previous owner was subject to a penalty notice the first time the vehicle was driven within the zone he would have been given 28 days to either make the vehicle emissions compliant (which he obviously didn't) or to pay the daily charge.

Thats the question... how to find if he did drive in the zone and get the letter. I think there is a 90% chance he didn't - but I may have worked a way around it by using a different vehicle, which has lower emission standards but is compliant/exempt

[bmcecosse]

Just put the plates and tax disc from the van that IS compliant- on the non-compliant vehicle for the day.......

[Matt]

well I did think about it... they are both N reg transits... but one is a red LWB and the other is a white SWB so it might be obvious, along with the plumes of black diesel smoke from the "petrol" engine

[irmscher]

as a Morris minor forum moderator i dont think you should be discussing this

[Matt]

What am I doing thats wrong then? ;)

All I really want to know is if a warning letter has been issued against my vehicle. I think I will ring TFL tomorrow

[irmscher]

dont even think about the plate swap you could end up eating porridge

[Matt]

Actually, I just rang TFL and spoke to a very nice lady.

The letter hasn't been issued so I can take the "non compliant" van in for 28 days starting whenever I choose

it is compleletly legit http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/lez/177 ... #container

[bmcecosse]

The plate swap idea was a joke.........geeeeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzzzzzzz. But I bet that goes on all the time.......

[bmcecosse]

But they will surely send you the letter - and then you will HAVE to pay?

[Matt]

Warning letters
We will issue a warning letter to the registered keeper of a vehicle that doesn't meet the Low Emission Zone (LEZ) emissions standards on the first occasion it's observed in the LEZ. This is provided it's not exempt, has registered for a 100 per cent discount or has paid the daily charge.

If the same vehicle is driven in the LEZ within a 28-day period from the date of issue of the warning letter, a Penalty Charge will not be incurred. After this 28-day period you risk being issued a Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) if you drive in the zone and your vehicle still doesn't meet the required emissions standard.

In the event of a change of keeper after the warning letter has been issued, any new keeper will not be issued a further warning letter. If the 28-day period after the warning letter has expired, a PCN will be issued to the registered keeper at the time of the contravention.

If you believe the warning letter has been issued in error you should contact us on 0845 607 0009

Tah dah! 28 days free from the 1st day you are spotted inside the LEZ...

I'm sure there has been lots of plate swapping, and I know someone who's compliant van was cloned and used in London...

[LouiseM]

Tah dah! 28 days free from the 1st day you are spotted inside the LEZ...

But you'll still have to pay the daily charge, so it's not really 'free'.

[Matt]

f the same vehicle is driven in the LEZ within a 28-day period from the date of issue of the warning letter, a Penalty Charge will not be incurred.

No you don't... If you paid you wouldn't have the letter to start with! And if you paid within (or outside the 28 days) of course they wouldn't issue a PCN making the letter pointless and irrelevant! By stating they won't issue a PCN within the 28 days why on earth would you pay? They have written to you officially saying that there will not be a fine if the vehicle is driven inside the zone within 28 days.

The LEZ isn't an absolute exclusion zone, its like the congestion charge but somewhat more expensive (£100-£200/day)

I am on the ford transit forum (which is more active than this one!) and I know (know... not just talk to on the forum) several people who have been going in and out in non compliant vans since January swapping vehicles every month...

I will report back if I get a large fine...