stuck track rod end :(

[alainmoran]

So I came to have my tracking done the other day & the fitter discovered that my offside TRE was well & truly stuck, he tried heat, I tried big spanners & hitting it with a hammer, all to little avail (after I'd finished with it it will move through about 30 degrees, but then sticks - he didn't get it to move at all).

I've just tried splitting the joint (typical tyre fitter - had nothing in the way of real tools) and having a go at it from all sorts of angles, but to no avail

Short of removing the entire steering rack I'm at a loss as to what to try next!

Ideas most welcome (even the wild ones)

[bmcecosse]

If it's moving slightly - and I assume you have managed to back the locknut away from the TRE - then apply loads of release oil - the REAL stuff - not just WD40 and let it soak in. It WILL come off. But put the taper pin back on - so you have a 'solid' shaft to work with.

[alainmoran]

Mmm .. ok, will 3-in-1 do?

EDIT: Yes I have backed the nut off ... that was easy - when it was put together it was copper-eased ... I suspect half of the problem is the heat that the fitter tried (without asking first), but hey :s

[MarkyB]

will 3-in-1 do?

It's a bit thick for this, a bit of diesel mixed in would help it soak in.

What did the fitter use as a heat source? Oxy-acetylene is the daddy and will shift just about anything.
A blow lamp probably wont cut it.

However you can heat it up with a blow lamp then push a candle against it and the wax gets drawn into the threads apparently.

[charlie_morris_minor]

the way i do it..

take the nut of the track rod end completely..

jack the car up, put an axle stand under the track rod end then lower the car on to it so that the bolt of the track rod end is supported on the axle stand. then lower the car on to another axle stand so that the car is supported on the second axle stand, not the first one, this is very very important.

I then empty a kettle of boiling water over the steering arm and then hit down hard down on the arm.. one or two big hits is normally enough to get them apart..

[bmcecosse]

Errrrr - that's not the problem in this case ! Interesting technique certainly - but much quicker to simply use a ball joint splitter. An no - 3in1 will NOT get the job done. Proper Plus Gas etc is the stuff to use.

[alainmoran]

Wow, that's a really interesting solution to not having a ball-joint splitter ... I do have one of those though (both types actually, although for track rod ends I tend to use the bolt-type).

As BMC rightly points out the problem here is not splitting the joint to the arm, but rotating the bar so that I can get the damned thing off the end of the steering rack so that I can replace it - the fitter used oxy, which of course ended up melting the gaiter, so even if it wasn't stuck it would have to come off!

I think my main problem here is getting a grip!

The flats on the steering arm are starting to round-off, so getting a decent torque on things is not a simple task!

It's possible that I'm going to need to take the rack off so that I can get the arm into a vice and spin the TRE off the end of it.

[alainmoran]

Is it possible to undo the ball assembly in the rack while it's still mounted on the car?

[chrisryder]

if you're replacing the tre anyway, have you got an angle grinder?

you'd need to be carefull not to go in too deep and damage the track rod, but if you can get a groove in most of the way, both sides if possible, then split it with a chisel?

[alainmoran]

Yes, that will be my VERY last resort ... I've already drilled a hole in the end of the TRE, just in case the problem was a vacuum seal caused by the application of heat to a copper-eased thread & cup!

I've taken a look-see through the Haynes book of lies, and it would appear I can get the steering rack out of the car without removing the engine, so I suspect that's my job for the weekend - once I can get a proper grip on the arm I should be able to 'persuade' the TRE off the end without resorting to cutting :s

I'll keep trying with the freeing oil and a set of mole-grips (vice-grips?) until then ... suggestions as to a better tool for gripping the rod would be VERY welcome!

[Chris Edgar]

I ran into exactly the same problem some time ago when I decided to replace the TREs on the 58 Convertible...
No way have I been able to shift the TREs on the track rods...as you say, the flats on the track rods do not afford much grip.

My plan therefore was to remove the whole rack. As far as I can see, following the BMC Manual, it should not be too hard a job.
Tricky maybe to get at the nuts on the rack clamps...may help to have 2 people when replacing the rack?

However, the car flew through the MOT last week (no advisories either) so this job has very much gone on the back burner.
I will be watching this one with interest...Good Luck!

Chris

[Chris Edgar]

Bye the way, are you not a Lancs. MMOC member?
...there is a Mechanics Day at Garstang this coming Saturday...loads of technical advice, assistance, tools & pies!

[alainmoran]

If I can get the tracking sorted by then I may pop along - PM me the details ... Garstang is only just up the road

There is no way I'm driving her with the way she is right now - it was bad enough driving to Bristol & back the other weekend - the tracking is so far out that above 50mph the front-end 'dances' as though you are in a massive cross-wind, it's quite scary really!

Since then I've drilled a hole in the TRE which would seriously weaken it and I dont much fancy it snapping off as I'm driving ... Masie might not be the prettiest minor in the world (a few scabs on the door bottoms etc), but I'd prefer her to remain in her current shape rather than wrapped around a tree!!!

[charlie_morris_minor]

Errrrr - that's not the problem in this case ! Interesting technique certainly - but much quicker to simply use a ball joint splitter. An no - 3in1 will NOT get the job done. Proper Plus Gas etc is the stuff to use.

doh! should have read it again

[alainmoran]

So, to update ... as ever BMC is completely correct

The solution appears to be a) Keep the TRE bolted to the steering arm as this keeps it more solid and easier to work with. b) Apply freeing oil every hour or so & wiggle the mole-grips so that the angle that it can move through slowly increases.

I'm now up to about 120 degrees of free rotation, I suspect I should have this TRE off by this evening (oh the joys of working from home)

[alainmoran]

OK, that's now off ... any suggestions as to how to avoid this happening again would be welcome ;)

[bmcecosse]

A couple of pairs of stillsons are brutal - but handy at times....... Glad you got it off in the end. Can only suggest wire brushing the thread - and wipe with copper grease. Yes - I note that was supposed to be on there last time - so if you don't trust it - just wipe with ordinary grease.

[alainmoran]

I ended up brushing it and not putting any grease at all on the thread, once it's all been adjusted correctly I'll cover the chuffer in grease to prevent any ingress ... ty for your suggestions

[beero]

I use large plumbers stilsons to grip the track rod. Because of the way they are made, the more pressure applied the stronger they grip. Shame I am too far away for you to borrow them.