Chipping a diesel

[bmcecosse]

Has anyone on here chipped up a diesel engine ? There are loads of chips offered - all claiming +20% power and -15% fuel consumption....... Sounds too good to be true of course, and therefore probably IS. So just wondered if anyone has direct experience to pass on ?

[MarkyB]

I've been tempted too but looking around the forums is seems that some are little more than resistors in a box that kid the car into thinking it's colder than is is, or something similar.
The fancy ones that really have a different engine map in and get good reports tend towards the pricey end of the spectrum .

[irmscher]

i had a bmw x5 diesel chipped all it did was trick the maff sensor more bhp but less mpg the real deal costs in excess of £500 and in real terms not worth a carrot .most chips just trick the memory settings of the ecu also if under any kind of warranty this will be void as when they plug it into a diagnostic machine it shows as i found out

[bmcecosse]

Well - that is my suspicion - since it seems to plug in to a sensor position, I do rather suspect the 'resistor' idea. I would only be interested if more mpg would genuinely be achieved (and I really don't see how that could happen...) - I don't drive this car for performance!
Have to say - I've tried on a couple of Ford forums to get answers to this (and a few other Qs) and the response is deafening - by it's silence....... These forums seem so dead compared to THIS excellent forum!

[indian301]

I chipped a 2005 Ford Diesel pick up. The kit consisted of a larger turbo housing, a complete exhaust system, and the remapped chip. The difference was amazing. It would spin the tires like a gas engine and it improved the fuel economy by 10%.

I do not know whether a chip alone on a diesel would make that much difference, but on a gas engine it will.

Dave From the USA

[MarkyB]

I believe one of the things they do is increase the pressure on the common rail, which presumably leads to better fuel atomisation.
If you can find a friendly mechanic at the main dealer they can add a lot of options from higher up the range by using the dealers diagnostic machine.
A chap in the office here managed to get this done to a Renault or a Citroen, including more power from the engine and several other things.

[rayofleamington]

To get more BHP is not a difficult science, but to do it well requires an ECU re-calibration (often called a re-map). The end result is usually greatly reduced engine lifetime.
To get improved MPG is a very different thing - it is often possible but at the expense of engine life and emmissions (albeit not the CO2 emmssions).

The Ford (pug) 1.4 diesels can be re-cal'd for more power. We had this on an 3 month old with automated manual gearbox - the secondary effects that brought the car back to the dealer was that the shift quality was wrecked, and slipping clutch behaviour too. The dealer did the repair (put the car back to standard and replaced the clutch for good measure..) and informed the owner that the repair was not covered by warranty - the chip tuner he used was pretty good and made sure the customer was awatre that it invalidates dealer warranty. The chip tune cocked up a lot of the other things the ECU did and the engine torque signal was no longer accurate - hence the 'faulty gearbox' behaviour.
On a manual vehicle the chip tune wouldn't have brought the car back to the dealer so quickly. I really wouldn't want to be the second owner of a chip tuned car!

[minor65]

I have seen cars chipped and the driveshafts /c v joints not fit for the extra bhp, for example vw golf 105 bhp has a smaller diameter driveshaft than the 140 bhp, beware.

[MarkyB]

I asked the guy in the office what they did for him, upped the engine power, turned on automatic lights and wipers as well as turning on the already fitted alarm, and sub woofer and configuring the alarm and central locking to his tastes.

It seems the same car comes off the end of the assembly line and they dial in the options you have paid for via the computer.

He drives like a maniac so the drive shafts must have been up to the extra power.

Economy of scale suggests this is what several manufacturers will be doing.

[Matt]

plenty of posative feedback on the ford transit forum about remaps - especially vantuner.co.uk and bluefin

Incidently I know the guy who runs vantuner and he tells it like it is! Some diesels you can do nothing with, about 50% can be improved. Plenty of stories about more power/torque and increased MPG, or increased MPG but same power or vice versa...

If you want send me what car/engine (including BHP) and I will see what he says?

Forget the "chips" though the only way to go is a remap

[bmcecosse]

I'll have a look at the Transit forum then Matt. It's the Ford 1.4 TDCi (so common rail) diesel . I can see how more power would be possible - but better economy beats me! Since every manufacturer is trying to outdo the other with best economy figures - I imagine Ford will already have optimised the engine for economy. And I certainly don't want to sacrifice economy for performance !!

[rayofleamington]

I imagine Ford will already have optimised the engine for economy.

They did - I worked with some of the engine calibrators - however as it's a Ford they also have to give it a sporty feel (so you get lots of torque with only light throttle - without this the car would be smoother - most of the 1.4 Diesel Fusions were bought by pensioners.. so the sportiness wasn't exactly an advantage).

However as an aftermaket calibration doesn't go through the official rules (including durability so the car can still be within 10% of the original emmissions figures when it's 10 years old) then I guess better mpg can be achieved - but I still wouldnt want to be the next owner. A diesel is only more economical if you don't have to spend more money fixing it..

[bmcecosse]

Just as well I'm a 'pensioner' then ! I guess they can improve the economy figures by effectively limiting the amount of fuel that goes in when the acc is floored. I'm effectively doing that myself - by NOT flooring the pedal!

[MColes]

Just as well I'm a 'pensioner' then ! I guess they can improve the economy figures by

... using your bus pass instead of the car

[phurn]

ccant see the benefit to chipping a deisel. the only reason anyone ever picks deisel over petrol is for economy... something your not really goign to gain by chipping.. not in the long run.
if youve got a sporty petrol on the other hand, and dont give two hoots bout economy then i say go for it by all means! be sure to read up and get a good job done though, those clip on boxes are worthless.

[polo2k]

Well, Im a bit of an advert for remapping.

There is several ways of doing a chip/remap. Originally "chipping" the ECU meant prising out the original chip fromt he ECU and then replacing it with a recoded one. There is also the tuning box option, that simply alters sensor outputs (i.e. changes the reported air density, or coolant temp.
The real way to do it these days is through the OBD port (diagnostic port), these can not be detected unless they are looked for. Again within this realy there are generic maps, these give less gain but are cheaper and quicker. your looking at around £300-£400. Then there is the bespoke version, with my golf we pulled the stock map including adaptations that the ecu had made, this was then emailled to a guy who tweaked it and sent it back, we uploaded it and then went back to him with feedback. He actioned the feedback and now I have a bit of a weapon!

Before I used to get 42-43mpg on A roads while keeping a good pace. Now I get 52-55mpg on the same roads (I have verified this the old fasioned way too)
Power is up from 130hp-172 hp
Torque is up from 230ft/lb to 330ft/lb

Driveability is brilliant with a wall of torque from about 1500rpm.

I have not broken a driveshaft yet, but I changed the clutch for a Leon Cupra R competition item when I did some gearbox work* at the same time I fitted a quaife because of the torque

*the stock diff is rivetted together so has a habit of exploding even at standard power.

Overall I would go back to standard power.
Another tip is that on a real remap, Optimax diesel makes a big difference.

And before anyone questions the figures, this is from last year on a rolling road (with a slight boost leak so only doing 1.8bar instead of the usual 1.9-2.0) engine is 1.9 PD TDI



Oh and I did a 15.2 with a terminal around 94mph on "the pod", all the while averaginf 40Mpg including sitting in the que each time round



Any questions, fire away

[MarkyB]

Nice to hear from someone with actual experience of the subject, what kind of money was the "the bespoke version"?

[polo2k]

It was through a customer of the company I was working for so we arranged some discount
IIRC the generic maps like superchips are about £350
and I think that a bespoke one is usually around the £500 mark with this guy, but you get what you pay for.
There are a lot of places that are offing a remap for around £400 with before and after dyno runs (I did mine seperately at a show)

[MarkyB]

Now I'm tempted too, like Roy, for the better mpg.
I do at least 250-300 miles a week and cannot get better that 43mpg.

[irmscher]

Marky seek the advice of Ahmed Bayjoo the master of chipping the performance guru