Stalling and kangaroos! Help!

[TRTerry]

1963 Moggie 1098 Traveller

Just started getting a bit of a problem , but cannot work out what the cause is.


First time, after driving for 3/4 hour today. The car stalled on accelerating from first gear. It immediately restarted from the starter and we carried on. Tank was 1/4 full.

Later on, around 30 mins in to our second journey today. The car 'kangarooed" from first gear for around 20 seconds then settled down ( full tank this time), like the engine was very weak at low revs, and responded to the accelerator, but only if revs kept higher than normal. Hence the kangarooing of high revs-dying to low revs and back up again as I compensated.

Third journey, around 30 mins again, car started to stall as I approached a junction, engine would only respond with any power if the choke was pulled out a bit. Smell of petrol, but not all the time. We continued home on 1/4-1/2 choke. If I depressed the clutch the engine would race, but if I did the same thing with the choke in, the engine would nearly stall. Cleared itself by the time I got home, around 15 mins later.

Have had a look under the bonnet while still running from journey, tried all leads and checked fuel lines and spark to all plugs, and linkages. All seems OK and I could not get the car to replicate the faults

Have recently fitted a muffler, and it has been 12 degrees today, and recently tightened up cylinder head (in last week/10 days) & adjusted tappets. One spark plug broke at its nipple end as I was getting it out, so replaced with another old one. Have been using a 123 Dissy for sometime now.

I did wonder if the engine was overheating, but the heater output did not seem too hot. Certainly not as hot as summer use.

Typical of the car to misbehave only while out in the dark.

Any idea or tests I could make? The wife uses this car a lot but I cannot let her use it with this hanging over it.


Thanks



Terry Pruce

[bmcecosse]

Could be intermittent loss of fuel supply - perhaps the electric pump is beginning to struggle. Or could be piston sticking in the carb - does it rise easily and fall back with a nice clunk ? And is there some oil in the carb dash=pot. Just possible it is carb icing - is the air intake trumpet aimed at the exhaust manifold ?

[mike.perry]

Check that all the HT leads are secure. Try running the engine in the dark and look for any stray sparks.
Possibly the condenser on its way out

[bmcecosse]

Condenser - in a 123 dizzy ????????

[DAVIDMCCULLOUGH]

Sounds a bit like the fuel is vapourising because its hotter than normal with the muffler on. As this is an easy option try taking it for a run without this fitted.

[bmcecosse]

Muffler = silencer.

[rsawatson]

I had similar symptoms to you when I had my Austin Metro - it would only run on the choke - although for me the problem was actually due to the petrol being contaminated with water. Hopefully this is not the case for you!

Fuel pumps can be intermittent; I've had first-hand experience , but on the whole are reliable and wouldn't account for you needing to use the choke to make the engine run. I'd check the fuel itself and also that the carb is operating properly as suggested by BMC - as by the sounds of things, the engine is being starved of fuel as opposed to air - which is why you need the choke out.

I hope this advice is sound.

[TRTerry]

Thanks for all the replies.

I have now checked oil and coolant, they are OK.

I suspect the radiator Muff is overheating the engine as these problems happened sometime in to the drive. So will take it for a run as suggested earlier and see how it goes without the muff given the air temperature was a 'warm 12 degrees C yesterday. Will also check for fuel delivery rate.

[bmcecosse]

Ahhh - your 'muffler' is actually a radiator blind!!!!!!!!!! Explains lots....... keep us informed. No need for a rad blind - the thermostat keeps the engine at the right temperature - if it's working. If not - fit a new one !

[TRTerry]

The Muff was for the Missus as a way to improve cabin temperature as she travels to her Mum's once a week. Not that it seems to have made that much difference!

Have now checked petrol flow and it is a plenty. Also checked dashpot, a bit low, and carb needle travel is smooth and rests at base with a nice positive click.

Strong spark to all cylinders and all pots affect the engine in the same way when the plug is disconnected. Have cleaned LT leads to coil as looked slightly corroded.

Muff off now so out for a run!

[mike.perry]

Condenser - in a 123 dizzy ????????

Sorry, what is a 123 dizzy? I know about DKYH4A and 25D

[Declan_Burns]

Mike,
This is it-it's supposed to be excellent and is a very popular mod out this way. I know quite a few people who have fitted it and all are very pleased-it's pricey though!
http://www.123ignition.nl/
Regards
Declan

[bmcecosse]

If you want to improve the cabin temp - fit a higher rated thermostat say 88 or even 92 degree.

[rayofleamington]

The symptoms sound partly like fuel pump issues but that wouldn't explain the symptoms relating to stalling at idle. Generally it would splutter and stall with no throttle or light throttle with or without choke if the carb was getting very low on fuel.

Therefore if removing the radiator muffler doesn't fix it, I'd suggest to check the throttle slide in the carb. If the throttle slide doesn't drop sharply back down and rise smoothly, then it will mess up the mixture at idle and cause stalling and also hesitation on accelleration. I'm not 100% sure it matches all your symptoms but could give most of what you describe.


As for improving the heater - I would expect your 1963 to have an external air inlet (ram pipe) from behind the grille to the heater. 1963 is pretty borderline as this pipe was just being introduced somewhere about that time.

The external ram pipe is good in the summer, but in winter it really limits the interior temperature.
As a fix for winter, remove the pipe behind the grille and block it up (e.g. using a few carrier bags). Then remove the other end from the heater. This stops the cold air from entering the heater and allows the heater to recirculate & re-heat interior (warmer) air.

The downside is that you may need to open a quarterlight when driving to help remove condensation when it's cold but not freezing - if you have -10°C for a week there shouldn't be much condensation as the air becomes extremely dry.

[bmcecosse]

It's also possible to tuck the open end of the hose in behind the radiator at the top - so it takes in pre-warmed air.

[Declan_Burns]

It's also possible to tuck the open end of the hose in behind the radiator at the top - so it takes in pre-warmed air.

Good idea but it should be secured-you don't want it hitting the fan blades.
Declan

[bmcecosse]

That's what tie-wraps are for!

[Declan_Burns]

Roy,
You know that and I know that and a lot of others know it too but there are plenty out there.......
I think you know what I mean.
Declan

[Nuffles]

My hose is tied behind the radiator too. I start getting warm air a few minutes in and it's hot enough to clear a foggy screen after 10 minutes or so.

[TRTerry]

Thanks for the tips,

Update.

Went for two one hour trips up and down the A46 to Mansfield, a round trip of 80 miles. Was faultless.

Had removed radiator muff, cleaned LT terminals on coil as looked a bit scruffy. Fuel pump delivering plenty of fuel, around 1 pint every 40 secs.

Also tightened loose breather pipe from rocker cover to carb, don't know what this is supposed to do. It did not seem to make any difference to the engine note wether this pipe was connected, or loose, or the carb end blocked off with my finger!

Have noted that no fuel filter is fitted so will add one ASAP.

Carb throttle slide as reported earlier seems OK.

I am beginning to think it was the muff as problems seemed to occur around 30 mins in to the earlier journeys, although the intermittence suggests not.

Will try to eliminate it on another warmish day.