Strange engine problem

[melanddoug]

Hi

I've just bought a Traveller with 1098 cc engine. I'm having a very strange problem ..

I suspect that the head gasket is blown, but the symptoms are odd:

* Oil in the water. lots of it. Enough to make the radiator cap covered in mayinnaise.
* Oil level not particularly dropping quickly, that I've noticed.
* Engine Oil is NOT going mayonnais-ey - it's still oil-coloured - brown/black (due for an oil change!).
* Losing water but not much. The oil in the water has revealed a v small leak in the radiator which could easily account for it.
* Water pressure doesn't seem to be excessive.
* Having had head gaskets blow before, it usually results in huge plooms of steam out of the exhaust etc.. it does steam a bit but not much - could just be normal 'cold weather steaming'.

Any thoughts? I guess It could be that it's kind of partially blown.. I'll probably end up replacing it at the heartstopping cost of £8 for a gasket, but thought I'd ask if this is a familiar problem for the A series before investing the time.

The other possibility is that it's just had oil poured in the water but I'm pretty sure it was ok when I got it a couple of weeks ago. I'll drain the water off and flush it over the weekend to check this, but it seems pretty unlikely.

er thinking about it - is there a recommended way of flushing oil sludge out of the water system ?

Many thanks

Doug

[bmcecosse]

As you say - a gasket is not expensive (£8 sounds too much though - shop around !) and will give you the chance to see the condition of the engine and to grind in the valves for best performance. But first - pull out the spark plugs - if one is very clean/white and the others are not - then there is water getting into the chamber with the white plug. The water cleans away all the carbon and gunk very nicely!! You can also drain the water and flush it all out well with a hose and then refill, and see if it stays clean. You mention a water leak - maybe your 'mayonnaise' is indeed just that - a previous owner's attempt at sealing the leak using the old trick of breaking a couple of eggs into the water!

[Matt]

The previous owner definately did not put oil or an egg in the water - but some radweld type stuff was put in several months ago - and the water leak appeared to have vansihed.

is it definately oil or could it be remenants of radweld?

[melanddoug]

Haha Matt - ta! I guessed you guys wouldn't have done that!

So the stuiff leaking out .. yep it looks like oil .. it floats in the water, and thick off-white gloop in the radiator cap.
The leak (halfway down the radiator engine-side) has a drizzle of blackish oily stuff coming out of it.

I think Radweld residue tends to be white-ish and kind of gritty? That was my plan for fixing the radiator leak as it's a tiny one, but I wonder whether the oil contamination might stop it working. I guess I'll find that out later.

I think i'll just change the gasket when time allows and eliminate that, and give him a good clean-up while I'm at it too.

bmcecosse - nice tip about the spark plug etc, thanks. I'll try that on Saturday too.

This forum is amazing. Everyone's really helpful. I'm really glad Mel and I have entered the Moggy world!

Doug
ps. my experience with head gaskets is fair- I've probably changed about 8 in my time, the first beeing 1725cc rootes engine in Humber Sceptre, in about 2 hours (I was getting rid of the car so ok to go quickly)
The last one was on a triumph 2500 6 cylinder engine. 5 hours work (including tappet set after).
Cost £40 for the gasket set.

"£8 sounds too much though - shop around !" made me giggle .. brilliant !

[Matt]

I dont recall changing the HG on that car so it may be the original 38 year old one

having said that my memory about what we have done with that car is not great - purely because its not my car!

I assume it got you back ok after the condeser change in the tesco car park?

[melanddoug]

Mostly - After the Tesco event, he blatted home ok but got within 1 mile and started coughing again. Same thing. Would you believe it .. he'd eaten another condenser! Dunno why.

I put another one on from my Stag (probably the same type) and that seems to have held. He runs really well now - cruises at 60-65 quite easily, enough power for 70 and more (but runs out of revs so only tried that once) - seemingly 37 mpg.
Plugs a shade too black so I think it's still a bit rich. Not bad though.

I had to block off some of the pancake air filter because although he accelerated ok, he didn't like holding a steady speed above about 45mph. A lot of missing and juddering. Ok if you accelerate though. Pulling the choke seemed to help so I guessed it was too lean .. my conclusion: The pancake air filter was too free running, so I put some tape arounfd about a third of the circumference. He's been good ever since.
I was going to ask Dan about that actually (ie whether there was ever any of that juddering/missing behaviour) but haven't got around to it yet - other priorities. Mostly Mel's saloon!

D

[katy]

Plugs a shade too black so I think it's still a bit rich

Pulling the choke seemed to help so I guessed it was too lean

[d_harris]

I didn't ever put Radweld in Monty as far as I can recall (and certainly no eggs! ) But the radiator was pre-used when fitted so I have no idea of its history. The HG is not original, it was replaced shortly after Monty was MOT'd - having been standing for so many years he blew the gasket on the first long run.

I also dont recall there ever being any juddering or missing when he was running - he used to go like stink (certainly far pokier than the current wheels...)

Re the radiator leak - the rubber hose that vents the rad is a bit short (it comes out behind the front grill, about halfway down) might just be worth checking that water is not being blown through the rad?

[bmcecosse]

Blanking off the pancake filter ! Well I never........ Crazy! You say elsewhere it's rich - so what you need is more air - not less

[melanddoug]

Hi bmcecosse,

Good point - that does read contradictoraly, but it was rich when ticking over (I think - not sure), lean when doing about 50 (on grounds that pulling choke a bit sorted out the misfire).

The air filter is a circular one 8" or so diameter with loads more aperture around the edge than the original moggy one, which seems to breath through a saucepan handle.

I'm still finding my way with this moggy so I daresay when I come to fix the carb situation properly, the tape will be discarded in liue of finding out what the actual problem really is.

d

[melanddoug]

Dan - the misfire @ about 50 was happening very slightly when we test drove it (don't know whether you remember me commenting ?) but latterly it seemed much worse until I taped up half the air inlet, which fixed it temporarily.

Confusing.

Thanks for the tip about the radiator leak - it might well be that actually.

Anyways you're right, he goes like stink when running ok!
If the Head Gasket is blown then I'm not going to get much sense out of the engine in terms of tuning until it's fixed, so I guess that's next (well, actually fitting wings to Mel's moggy is next!)

Thanks all for info. Katy- your style is inimitable, and although I think you've misunderstood, actually you have made me think. thanks.

Doug

[bmcecosse]

It could be 'rich' when idling if the float level is too high or the float valve is leaking allowing too much fuel in. When running the fuel will be used up - BUT because the jet has perhaps been set 'weak' at idle to try to compensate for the fuel overflow - it's now too weak when running! So - switch on the ignition, but don't start up - does the fuel pump tick away steadily ??

[melanddoug]

I found t'tother day that after running him up to temp, then stopping and leaving him to stand (say, for example to buy a kebab, which I regretted afterwards), he has real trouble starting and the telltale clouds of steam erupt from the exhaust.

Hoping head gasket kit will arrive today, and if so will change it tonight. Or at least I'll get as far as I can.

Once that's done I can get a sensible check on the tuning. Thanks again bmcecosse.

[bmcecosse]

Have you any idea of the cr@p that goes into a kebab /

[d_harris]

Oh, this thread has just reminded me. I found another set of keys for Monty that I'd forgotten about. expect a small package in the not too distant

[melanddoug]

Re Kebab: Let's just sday I'm still not quite feeling right, and the kebab event was on Sunday. Delicious at the time, but I shan't be doing that again.

Dan: Bonus! thanks!

D

[bmcecosse]

For a strict vegetarian (like me!) a Kebab is a particularly revolting prospect.....

[melanddoug]

I once saw a "vegertarian kebab" event which was a donner kebab but with a crucial element missing, and replaced with more salad.

Yes that's right: Some lettuce in a pitta bread, with more lettuce for garnish.

Kebabs = less delicious for vegetarians, it seems (but probably more edible).

[MarkyB]

a Kebab is a particularly revolting prospect

If one wait till one is sober, and the kebab is cold, the full horrors are revealed.
Lovely slices of heart attack inducing, artery clogging, fat basically.

The veggie option may not be as tasty, but you won't regret having eaten it the next day.
For tasty, without deadly, try Hummus.

[melanddoug]

MarkyB - therein lies the trouble. I was stone cold sober. Kebabs are for people with at least 4 pints of lager inside them, I think. As a friend once said to me at a local rock festival: "You're mad to attempt this sober."

Meanwhile .. Just changed Monty the Wayward Traveller's head gasket (3.5 hours .. not bad for a first go on a moggy!)

First impressions are: Excellent. runs much more smoothly and starts right away. Phew!

Now I can gradually sort out any tuning issues- altough he's now running so muh better i'm not sure I need to!

D