Convertible Hood Problems

[swithland]

Hello everyone. Im struggling to get my new hood to fit properly at the back. I fitted the hood correctly ( I think ) by starting at the back and lining everything up so the botom section of the hood overlaps the boot hinges a little. I followed up by tacking the hood to the rear ash frame. Then I went on to the front, leaving the tensioning rail down at the back. The front fits great as does the centre and the sides, but the rear section even with the tensioning rail in place is flappy and loose as if the rear section is too big.

I cant tighten the hood from the front any more because the sides are already megga tight and its not possible to pull the centre up any further.

The hood was specially made using the fabric they use in mercedes convertibles. The fabric is amazing ( I can recommend it as its heavy duty and has a nice herring bone pattern on the inside ), but I suspect either the tensioning rail at the back has not been made long enough to make the hood tight at the back, or the hood has been made too big at the back.

Does anyone recognise this problem and how I should go about correcting it ?

Ive been thinking of solutions and so far the best I can think is to remove the tensioning rail, then break the welding on the rail sides, extending the side bars and rewelding up to make the tensioning rail longer. That may take up the slack, but I think it needs a good inch and a half to make it really tight.

Ive even tries bending the tensioner rail in the middle to push the hood out, but that makes little difference.

Its a real shame because the hood looks great at the sides and front. A tight back would really finish the car off nicely.

HELP !!!!
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[Peetee]

On the Minor 1000 there is a stud on each side of the hood which clips over a peg at the bottom rear corner of the side window. I can't say for sure if it should be present on earlier cars but I can't see why not.

[swithland]

You are right. Ive got some clips to fit with a special tool, but even pulling the cover tight at the corners does not seem to make any difference apart from tighten the sides even more !! I think im going to take the tensioning rail out, grind out the welds and extend the back section an inch to take up the slack. I know I should not have to do that, but it seems the only practical and cost effective solution. Thanks for your advice on the pegs.

[Peetee]

It looks from your photos like the hood has been fastened to the top of the rear rail. It should be stapled or nailed to the rear edge of the wood.

[swithland]

Hi, it is tacked on the rear facing edge, but its so loose that it does look like its tacked on the horizontal surface of the wood. Its a really frustrating problem to solve. I really dont want to chop and extend the tensioner rail, but dont seem to see any other option.

[Peetee]

Looking at the side photo again, I wonder if the curvature of the hood around the rear side windows is correct? It looks a little too deep and the curvature radius a bit large. That would explain the diagnonal crease across the two panels as the hood is contacting the side window in one place. It looks like the custom hood has been measured up against an old baggy hood. Also, was the hood a tight fit when you fastened it to the the pegs behind the rear windows? That was a real 'thumb-buster' on my car - but the fit is good.

[swithland]

I think you are right. Ive just had a look at a pic of one thats on Canterbury Convertibles website and the curvature at the back window is different. I think im going to have to remove the whole hood and send it back. If came from the Don Trimming company. Problem is that to remove a hood effectively ruins it when you take out all the tacks. Urghhhh what a mess. Thanks for the comment, I nver spotted the manufacture mistake on the curvature around the rear window. Many thanks.....and lets see what Don Trimming company have to say !![frame][/frame]

[Peetee]

There is another possibility. That is that the bracket that fixes the hood frame to the car is positioned too far forwards. That would also go some way to explaining the visible step in the hood as it leaves the fillet.

[IaininTenbury]

I got Don Hoods to do mine, and fit it as they're local to me and I'm happy to let someone who does it everyday do the job. Its the same material as yours (herringbone pattern on inside) and seems really good quality. Sorry I can't help with fitting tips as I wasn't there but I left my camera with them and they took the following during the day. Looks like they sat the hood on and then trimmed and sewed the edges to suit the car. Only advice I can suggest is to contact them and see what they recomend.

Pics should be better than the Canterbury ones for comparing as its the same age car which are a different hood frame to the Minor 1000s

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[swithland]

Hi Lainin

Yours look fabulous. In fact yours is exactly the same colour too. I agree the facric is excellent. Looking at yours I can see the curve of the hood is very smooth, but mine seems not to have that same smooth curve. Ive now dropped them an email with pictures and asked them to provide some advice !! There is just one thing I would like to check....could you tell me what distance your hood brackets are from a measuring point on the car such as the inside edge of the side screen. Im wondering if its possible the brackets are in the wrong position......although they shouldnt be, but I suppose anything is possible.

Many thanks, Charles.

[swithland]

Lainin, ive had a closer look at your photo and spotted something that is very peculiar !! The frame gaps between the tensioner rail and the rail in front of that are in totally different positions. I cant see how that could be unless the frame was manufacturered incorrectly, but then again, the frame seems to fit perfectly on the car. I only needed to do a litttle twisting to get the frame to level up and to even the gaps between the rear side windows before I fitted the hood. Im really confused now.

Also, the position of the hood frame bracket looks to be the same as yours, so im thinking that could not be the problem.

I will just have to wait and see what the hood supplier have to say. I hope they are going to have a quick and easy solution !! Thanks again for your great photos. They do help a lot.[frame][/frame]

[swithland]

Ive just checked a few more Series II hood pics and there appears to be some that have the same position of the hood frame bars as mine, and others like yours. Maybe the replacement frames are different to the originals. Ive also noticed that the hood from Don Trimming does not have a sewn line across every rail bar unlike the other types of hoods like PVC or Double Duck. The Don hood only has a sewn strip going across the hood just above the rear window.

[LouiseM]

Maybe the replacement frames are different to the originals.

From the photos it looks as though you have a Minor 1000 frame fitted which would explain why a split screen hood doesn't fit properly.

[swithland]

Hi Louise, the split screen frame has a sharp bend in the middle of the front bar which is correct. I wonder if ESM's frame supplier had used the correct front bar, but had welded it to a later spec frame....

I have had a closer look at a few more split screen convertible photos, and even some of them have the same positions for the frame looking through the side windows. This is really very peculiar. There must be a load of split screen convertibles on the road and Ive not seen a similar post from anyone. The pic below shows a split screen with the forward upright section of frame shown through the side window in the vertical position which is again like mine.

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[IaininTenbury]

The green convertible just pictured has a Minor 1000 type hood frame, (other than the header rail with the V shape). There are three crossbars between the header rail and the hoop over the back window, wheras mine only has two. This will be why upright visible in the side window leans forward further than the later cars.
The later version is an improvement as it gives a curvier hood line, more like the saloon roof and a better fit over the side wndows. The hoods are generally done in horizontal strips with stitching over each metal hoop, whereas the earlier cars have a large centre peice and two narrow side pieces so there is a fore and aft seam from windscreen to rear hoop (visible inthe front view of my car and I assume yours is the same if you ordered a hood for a Series 2)
Having said that I would have thought that the early hood would have fitted the later frame well enough - probably even pulled it tighter. And the free floating rear hoop above the window looks to be at the same angle as mine so I doubt thats the explanation.

[swithland]

Looking at the free floating tensioner rail just above the back window....yours seems to stick out quite a bit more than mine does. Do you know if that tensioner rail does stick out further on the Series II than the later 1000's ? I ask this because I can see clearly after your explanation that the ESM split screen frame is definitely the later type frame, but with the early front angled bar above the screen. If the earlier ones have a floating tensioner that does stick out further then that is where mine is going wrong and would eman I would have to extend that rail by unpicking the welding seem between the curved tube and the flat steel sides and then extend by about an inch and a half.

You are right, my cover has two long sewn strips along the length of the car on each side. personally, I think that looks smarter than the later 1000's and with the later frame makes a tidy job.

[IaininTenbury]

I see what you mean re the floating tensioner. Mine does seem to stick out further than yours on that comparison picture. It was probably neatened up when the hood frame was redesigned for the Minor 1000s. I'll try and get some measurements tomorrow tht may help. I've got an old original Minor 1000 hood frame smewhere in the stores so assuming that is what yours is based on, I could check that against my Series 2 frame and see if theres any differences...

if that is the case it would certainly explain why a Series 2 hood is a limp fit, and as they work from templates your hood would have been cut to the same dimensions as mine.

[Peetee]

Perhaps the problem is a mismatched tensioner frame. The series 2 tensioner might sit more upright to make allowance for the lesser number of frame hoops in the main frame.It would therefore be shorter and once in the position of a 100 tensioner it would not sit high enough.
Alternatively, you have had a hood made to series two dimensions and it's sitting on a 1000 frame. The whole of the main roof section of your car looks a little low in the comparison shot. It's conforming to the Minor 1000 shape and, as mentioned before, the roofline of the series 2 tourer is less like the Saloon than the later cars.

[IaininTenbury]

Measurement from the pivot to the flat of the hoop is just under 18" on my car. Seemed the same on the rusty old Minor 1000 hood frame I've got too.

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[swithland]

Hi Iain, posting those pics is a great help as well as the measurement, thank you. It going to be a few weeks before im back in the UK to check that measurement so will ask a friend to drop in and take a look for me. I spoke with Tom at the workshops of ESM yesterday and I also pointed out that the bottom of the curved rail over the door windows on each side were just clipping the tops of the doors. Aparently there should be at least and inch gap ( which sounds like the roof should be higher than it currently is ).

Tom seems to think that the rails have been welded wrongly on the frame ( too low ) or they have not been bent correctly before welding which he reckons could be the reason there is slack on the cover. That would not really explain why the hood is slack only at the back though

He was saying that the replacement hood frames are really not very good and in all cases, its best to re-use the original hood frame and fit new rivetts. Shame I threw the old one away.

One solution he came up with was to weld an extension on the end of the tensioner rail. I suppose I had better do nothing until ive checked the measurement of that tensioner rail.