Replacing one-speed wiper motor with later two-speed

[Fingolfin]

Hi all,

I searched around but couldn't find exactly what I needed. My situation is this:

I have a '59 948 with one-speed wiper motor, and have recently obtained a later two-speed motor in beautiful condition, and a headlamp switch with the two settings. I'd like to upgrade to the two-speed motor.

Is it a straight swap, i.e., switch the switches and the motors, and add a wire for the second speed, or is there more to it? I've read that the later two-speed motor has a different angle of wipe than the early, so will I need to switch gears? Can I keep my existing wheelboxes?

Many thanks from your friend Fin.

[bmcecosse]

Worrying about wipers - while the car is seriously rusted............ I think you need to organise your priorities! But - you should first check the wheel angle in both gearboxes - if the same = no problem. If different - can you swap them ?

[charlie_morris_minor]

hi
no moggy was ever fitted with a two speed motor I assume you have a lucas 2 speed motor..

depending on the source of your motor you will need to swap the metal drive wheel for one with a 100 degree sweep.. all wheels have the sweep written on them so it is easy to know if you have the correct one.. a possible source is triumph 2000 and the spitfire gt6 range.

as for rewiring you need to do a complete rewire but it is very straight forward.. do a search in google for lucas wiper motor wiring.. you will need a relay to allow things to work correctly..

[Fingolfin]

LOL, BMC, here too? No worries. As I put on the carb topic, it's all being sorted.

The new motor has a 110º angle of wipe, as stamped on the wheel. The old one I can't see but I'm assuming it's 100º. The old wheel is much smaller than the new, so I don't think it's a straight swap...so...have I purchased something I can't use? I daresay Triumphs and Spitfires aren't near as common in the States as in England.

[charlie_morris_minor]

no it is not a straight swap.. you can modify the later 1 speed wheels to fit the 2 speed motor but i do not think you can modify the early ones.. although this is based on the 100 degree 2 speed wheels being easily available.

If you would like me to be a staging post to getting you a 100degree wheel i am happy to post on things to you, if a uk ebayer does not want to post it out to you

however if you have access to a lathe you might be able to modify the 1 speed wheel to fit..

there are severl issues you have..

the drive spigot is to tall to fit under the cap of the 2 speed motor, just chop a bit of it off until it clears the lid and cut a new retaining circlip ring.
modify one of the drive arm that goes from the spigot to wiper rack, the old one will not fit under the lid and the diameter of the drive spigot is to big for the new 2 speed arm. (at least it was on mine)
the wheel itself will need to be reduced in diameter and two locating slots cut to engage with the plastic drive wheel
the final one i believe is to reduce the diameter of the central locating spigot as this is too large for the 2 speed motor ( i recall but i could be wong )

do you have the mounting pad? if not get one from a landrover they are cheaper ( at least in the uk) then ones for MG etc and they are exactly the same.

[charlie_morris_minor]

this one should have the correct wheel..

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Triumph-Spitfire- ... 2308a4ac8f

and seems happy to post any where if you ask the price

[Fingolfin]

You're a godsend, Charlie. I really appreciate all of it. But tell me -- could I not just use the Triumph motor itself, rather than flipping wheels? Assuming I buy it, of course. I suppose I'd have to make up a new bracket.

I do have access to a lathe! We have one in our workshop, but no one ever uses it.

A mounting pad, huh?...all I know is I have the original 1-speed early motor fit in my car, and that's mounted on a large triangular metal piece. At first glance the 2-speed motor I bought and the 1-speed in the car have the same mountings, but I haven't experimented yet.

[charlie_morris_minor]

if you read this thread you will see a photo of my installation.. and you will see i asked much the same question as you did..

http://www.mmoc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f= ... er#p324499

i made up a metal plate which i mounted on to the original triangular plate where the 1 speed motor is mounted, i did this so that if someone at a later date wanted to go back to a one speed motor they could do so easily. you could of course just weld an extension plate onto the existing triangular mount.

If you look at the picture you will see it has a strap around the motor, this is the standard way of mounting the 2 speed motor..

having read your last comment it appears that we might be talking different motors.. any chance of a photo?

yes just using a triumph motor will be easier, however it will be cheaper just to send a wheel and arm to America rather than the whole motor ( well that was my reasoning and i am going to stick to it )

[Fingolfin]

[frame][/frame]

It looks just like my existing motor, except it has connectors on the end '1' '2' and 'E', and has a much larger wheel. The 'motor' part of the motor, I think, is just the same. I assumed that '1' and '2' meant it had two speeds, did I assume incorrectly?

I'd followed your topic with great zeal, and was very interested in the Triumph motor (in the picture) -- but I believe Triumphs aren't common over here...neither their parts. But now I'm registered on eBay (can you believe I wasn't before?), and sent the fellow you suggested a message.

[bmcecosse]

The Triumph TR7 was specifically built for export to USA - and plenty of the earlier Triumphs over there too...........

[Fingolfin]

Ack! BMC, you're making my ignorance (more) apparent! I'll rephrase: I've never seen a Triumph, and most everyone I'm familiar with hasn't heard of them. I'll go looking...

[charlie_morris_minor]

I believe that is a one speed motor..

1 and 2 are "on running" and "on park" so when you turn the power off the motor still runs to park then stops.

E is earth

that could well be a one speed motor from a mini.

the lucas 2 speed motor looks like the one in my photo and was used in triumph, mini, mg, landrover etc etc.. they just changed the wheel to get the arch that they required.

if you do buy the motor ask him has he got the wiring plug as well. this is a 5 pin affair and is not cheap to buy new even on ebay..

[bmcecosse]

Could be two speed - there are two speed versions of that motor. Look at the brush gear - if there are 3 brushes - it's two speed.

[Fingolfin]

[frame][/frame]
It's got two brushes, if I'm looking at the right things...(no experience with electric motors!)...so it's a one speed. Oh well. But how could I possibly have obtained a Mini wiper motor? They're so rare in the US...only like 10000 of them were shipped over to begin with. (Excluding the possibility the motor was imported on its own.)

[charlie_morris_minor]

could be from a landrover, how rare are they?

the 110 degree wheel could have been fitted to many cars I was just guessing mini as it is popular in the uk

[bmcecosse]

Single speed - fitted to many many cars- not just Minis!

[Fingolfin]

Hey, I don't know this stuff. No worries. Land Rovers are pretty common over here. I'm unsure as to how widespread Lucas electrics were in that timeframe -- I wasn't to be born for another thirty years -- but maybe I can find out...hmm.

So -- I have a one-speed wiper motor -- with a 110 degree angle-of-wipe -- so it's basically useless for what I want to do? Of course!

[charlie_morris_minor]

Single speed - fitted to many many cars- not just Minis!

the only reason why i chose the mini was because what i recall from my search for the 100 degree wheel earlier this year was the mini wiper wheel is 110 degree ( could well be wrong ) as it is in the landrover and probably others