My wheel bolts work loose!

[Dean]

Would anyone have any suggestions as to why they work loose? I'm going to replace them for new ones for starters... also I'll use some thread lock.. but it's worrying me a tad!

My wheels are balanced although I do get some vibration at 35mph which clears once I drive through it, but I wouldn't have thought it'll be this. Also my wheel holes (in the wheel) where the bolts locate are good and sound.. and before you ask, yes I'm pretty certain I'm doing them up tight although I don't measure the torque just do them hand tight.

So it's confusing me too?

Any ideas if anyone has had this before... would be much appreciated.

Thanks

[RobMoore]

They should not work lose under normal conditions.
imho hand tight is not tight enough, on all my cars in the past I have tightened by hand then using my trusty spider tightened them till I hear the metal make a snap sound.

[PSL184]

tightened them till I hear the metal make a snap sound.

Hopefully not the sound of the stud snapping

45lbs/ft on a torque wrench is the safest way......

[autolycus]

There's nothing magic about wheel nuts, so normal principles and precautions:

Make sure the holes in the wheels haven't enlarged - with the wheel off, offer up a nut and make sure it doesn't protrude through the hole. If it does, it will tighten to the drum before it grips the wheel.

Clean all crud off the mating faces of the wheel and the drum - it may take quite a bit of scraping and wire brushing to make sure there's no rust. Then smear grease fairly thinly over these surfaces.

Make sure the threads on the stud and in the nuts are clean, then grease the threads and the seating face of the nuts. Copper grease if you like, but it's not critical. This way, you ensure that a consistent proportion of the torque you apply goes into tensioning the stud and the threads of the nut, not overcoming friction.

Tighten the wheel nuts progressively, with the wheel off the ground until they're all close to final tightness. I always do a final check immediately before the hub caps go back on.

If you're of normal strength, use the wheelbrace supplied, or a socket with a bar of similar length. If you're really unsure, borrow a torque wrench and get a feel for how tight 45 lb-ft is. Rolls-Royce never used to quote torque figures: Sir Henry used to ensure that if you used the correct spanner, and had enough nous to be doing the job in the first place, you'd tighten nuts correctly.

As for "using my trusty spider tightened them till I hear the metal make a snap sound.": just occasionally (and more frequently since I started reading this messageboard) I think that d-i-y car repairs should perhaps be banned, after all.

Kevin

[MarkyB]

35 mph is quite a low speed to get a vibration from an out of balance wheel, about 50 mph is more normal.
I'd check that all the wheels spin true and haven't been bent in an accident.

[mike.perry]

You have all missed the vital clue in the title- Wheel BOLTS

Have you got the 5/8 A/F head bolts? These tend to wear the holes in the wheels. The answer is to fit 3/8 whit head bolts if you can find any. The production of large head bolts is being investigated.
See the article on axle threads on the Series MM website, tech. info

[bmcecosse]

Well - I noticed it was BOLTS right from the start. Can only repeat what others have said - torque them up properly. But it is likely that the threads in the hubs have some wear on them - it may now be at the 'too-much' stage!

[Dean]

Thanks for the advice everyone.

I'll do a good cleaning exercise and make sure I tighten them up enough. I'll get myself a torque wrench the weekend. I'm hoping it's as simple as a robust tightening exercise!

[Dean]

Have you got the 5/8 A/F head bolts? These tend to wear the holes in the wheels. The answer is to fit 3/8 whit head bolts if you can find any. The production of large head bolts is being investigated.
See the article on axle threads on the Series MM website, tech. info

I'll take a look Mike thanks, not sure of the head size.. but 5/8 does seem about right.

[polo2k]

worst case scenario, it wouldnt be that hard or expensive to cut all new threads and just use bigger bolts. would helicoils work?

[mike.perry]

One of the first jobs I did on my Series MM. I could hear the front wheel knocking and checked to find that it was moving on the hub when the bolts were fully tightened.
I checked through my tin of nuts and bolts and found some wheel nuts that screwed onto the MM wheel bolts. I bought a set of 7/16 UNF high tensile steel bolts (early MMs are BSF), screwed them into the hubs from the inside out, cut the heads off and and peened them over, then had them welded in place. I fitted a set of wheel nuts (Austin Maxi) with 3/4 A/F heads which cured the problem and it is easier to fit the wheels onto the studs.

[Dean]

Well great news the bolts I bought don't fit... doh! Correct outside diameter but the new ones have less TPI.. mine are quite a fine thread.

Mike for info... they are 3/8 whit head bolts.

Bought a torque wrench too and set it to 64Nm... and the bolts went tighter quite significantly before the click. So I'm hoping that has done it. Will take it for a spin later and report back over the weekend. I don't think it is helped by the fact I had the wheels powder coated, the powder coat is quite thick and as the torque wrench was tightening the coating was peeling off. Perhaps using the hand tightening method the bolt was locking on coating rather than metal... just a thought.

The good news is the bolts were a good fit in the drum, so no wear and they weren't hitting the drum before they were tight.

[bmcecosse]

Sounds promising!

[Dean]

Well........ just got back from good hard blast down the A38 and they were still tight when I returned! Definitely feels like I had a personal problem with my bolts. Thanks for all your help


I would highly recommend a torque wrench... £16.50 from Toolstation.

[mike.perry]

Don't forget to take the torque wrench or a power bar in the tool kit when you go out. If you get a puncture you are never going to shift the bolts with the bit of bent wire in the tool roll.

[mike.perry]

Well great news the bolts I bought don't fit... doh! Correct outside diameter but the new ones have less TPI.. mine are quite a fine thread. Mike for info... they are 3/8 whit head bolts.

What is the TPI of the new bolts? With 3/8 whit heads they are goingto be useful to someone

[Dean]

I don't know Mike, they came from Bull Motif and as they didn't fit I got a refund.

[mike.perry]

Cheers, I will chase that up at the Nat. Rally, I want to find out exactly what is on the market so that I know what needs to be produced.