Midget 1500 engine

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Not a Minor question buy you guys seem to know all about midgets as well. I have a chance to buy a 1977 Midget for $600 good solid car but pops out of reverse. I have a ribbed case trans out of an earlier Midget I believe with the 1250 motor. Will it fit to the 1500 engine??? The car has some other problems but they are just from setting for a few years (in a garage).
Thanks,
Martin

[mike.perry]

The 1275 Midget engine and gearbox is an Austin/Morris unit, the 1500 engine and box is a Triumph unit. I expect that if it was possible to mix them we would have heard about it on this website. If there is a conversion clutch housing available it may be possible to fit a 1500 box onto a 1275 engine but not the other way around

[RogerRust]

moved to off topic

[bmcecosse]

No - the ribbed case box won't fit that Triumph engine. You could of course fit a complete 1275 A series engine - and that box, and discard the hopeless 1500 Triumph engine!

[Matt]

As said, the gearbox is the same as a triupmh one, im guessing it might be easier to find over there than an A series one

[Blaketon]

The 1500 used the single rail BL box, as per the Marina and rear wheel drive Triumphs. The Midget version is not a Marina box, though it is similar. The starter motor is on the left in a 1500 and the prop shaft is different.

A lot of Triumphs used the overdrive box but this won't fit the Midget unless you do what I did and modify the car (The bell housing is the same for box boxes). The result is worthwhile.

The Midget 1500 had a reputation for eating engines (I met the second owner of mine a few years ago, who told me that the original engine went under warranty). It never had such a bad name in the Spitfire, where the sump was better cooled.

It is a long stroke engine and so is not a screamer by nature (The 1500 Midget is a tad under geared too, hence the overdrive is a good idea). Part of the problem is down to quality control and some engines had rather too much crank end float. In the Midget, cooling is a problem, made worse by the fact that the 1500 had a rubber bumper where there was once an air intake. The number plate blocked the air vent, beneath said bumper. The sump is also shielded from the air flow by the suspension cross member and so oil can get too hot. Provided these areas are looked at, I would not call the engine "Hopeless".

I have fitted an oil cooler (Thermostatically controlled) and fitted a self adhesive number plate to the bumper. This may sound a bit crude and it was only meant to be temporary but it actually looks OK and its now been on there over twenty years. The opening, in the valance, beneath the bumper has been enlarged (The oil cooler is fitted behind it – and behind a guard) and the bonnet has two rows of louvers (And all that silly sound deadening felt has been removed). In conjunction with the overdrive, this makes quite a difference to the way the car was when I had it. Furthermore, my engine now gives over 100bhp, so the cooling requirements are increased.

[bmcecosse]

Well done! You seem to have sorted out the problems. I agree about an oil cooler for any engine giving 100 bhp. Can't understand how it would be 'low geared' since it should have the 3.7 final drive, although with 13" wheels of course. With overdrive - your theoretical top whack must be something approaching 150 mph!

[Blaketon]

Up to 1977, Midgets had 3.9 CWPs and would run into the red in top. From 1977 on (In conjunction with the change to Spitfire instruments and no oil pressure gauge - I have remedied that !!) they went to 3.7 CWPs. That meant, with standard 145/13 tyres, that 70mph was about 4000 rpm. With the overdrive, that meant 88mph at 4000rpm (I run 165/70 13 which is more or less the same gearing wise as a 145/13). Because of my hillclimbing, I have a 3.9CWP but to be honest, the 1500 has enough torque to manage the 3.7 and I may well put it back in one day but it will mean swapping over the Quaife diff.

[bmcecosse]

88mph at 4000 rpm = 154mph at 7000. I wasn't too far away!

[Blaketon]

I don't think even a fully balanced 1500 like mine would take kindly to 7000 rpm . Its good for 6500 but I rarely go over 5000 these days and even in hillclimbs, I used to change up at 6000, unless it was a short burst between corners. The funny thing is that engines all seem to "Sound" similarly stressed at their maximum revs. I once had a Jedi single seater and that had a 500cc square four, two stroke Suzuki engine. The red line was 12000 and it ticked over at about 3000. Before I drove it, I wondered what revving it up to 9000 and then letting it go would be like. In the event, apart from being very fast and everything happening very quickly (There was an audible alarm inside my helmet, that cut in at 11800 rpm), it didn't seem a lot different to revving a normal engine to 6000. I am sure an old 14 litre Itala would be the same at 1000rpm!!!

[StaffsMoggie]

I have just bought a late 1500 Midget, thought it would be interesting to see how it compares to the B and Spitfire, plus I have always liked them, especially in black like this one! (Those are my excuses anyway...)

That Triumph engine is ok as long as it doesnt get too much of a spanking, the best one was the 1296cc unit out of the MK3 Spit, that engine revs very well. The later 1296 in the MK1V had heavier conrods and was rather rev shy...

[Mogwai]

Just out of curiosity how many people on this forum have an MG Midget ? I hadn't taken much notice until I got one myself , there seem too be quite a few in sig pics etc

[Blaketon]

I've had my 1500 going on for 26 years and my father has had his 1275 for nearly 4 years. His is pretty standard, mine is not (Unless you consider the fact that the engine is derived from a "Standard" Eight). Great little cars, whether as relatively cheap fun cars or as seriously quick race cars.[frame][/frame]

[Mogwai]

Here's my beastie. it hadn't been run for about 8 years until I got it.
Its been modified quite a bit by the previous owner who had it since 79, 1380cc A+ MED built engine 5spd Toyota box frontline suspension brakes etc , gets to naughty speeds very quickly [frame][/frame][frame][/frame]

[bmcecosse]

VERY nice indeed! I like my roofless car to have a roll-over bar - can't see if yours has one, if not - something to think about!