Toyota 5 speed & Hydraulics

Post by **d_harris** » Sun May 03, 2009 5:53 pm

Had a weird happening today.

In short, a bloke on a moped waved me down and said "I've got a 5 speed for one of those, want it?" So a big "yes please" went on.

Now, it was fitted to a midget and has a hydraulic clutch. What can I do to convert this to the minor, rip it off and try the minor approach or use a minor hydraulic conversion (in which case, where would I obtain one of these...)

I'm guessing I'm going to need to change the transmission cover, but how big a mod am I likely to need?

Thanks in anticipation guys....

Post by **bmcecosse** » Sun May 03, 2009 6:27 pm

I would use Minor mechanical arrangement.

Post by **Mogwai** » Tue May 05, 2009 9:09 pm

My brother inlaw had a Toyota box in his A35 he used midget hydraulic slave on it as he had an A40 pedalbox fitted . you could use the minor mechanical linkage would just need to make up some sort of support for the relay shaft on the gearbox. He used a few different clutches but was most successful with a 1098 minor cover

Post by **downsey** » Wed May 06, 2009 4:26 am

If you're referring to the toyota t-50 5 speed, then using the mechanical linkage for a right hand drive vehicle will be difficult. The fork is on the left side and they never made a cover such that you could swap the fork to the other side. Furthermore, the bellhousing only has an opening for the fork on one side. I suppose you could do a cable linkage? Would be easier to just mount a master cylinder on the side of the frame rail and use the stock Toyota slave cylinder.

Post by **Longdog** » Wed May 06, 2009 5:52 am

You could always do what I have done which is to ditch the original linkage in favour of a direct rod from the bottom of the clutch pedal.These are easy to make and you get a really light positive clutch action.You can fabricate one from 8mm steel rod.

Post by **downsey** » Wed May 06, 2009 6:17 am

^^ exactly what i did on mine. You need a stabilizer bar running parallel to the engine up to the front cross member though. With my 4age conversion, i tried a direct clutch rod without it and it would pull the motor back a good 1/4 inch before the clutch would engage.

As stated before, you cant do it unless your car is left hand drive.

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed May 06, 2009 8:34 am

All sounds an awful lot of work to get that fifth speed! Low ratio (3.73) diff with standard gearbox on my car works just fine - gives decent cruising at reduced revs, and took less than 2 hours to install!

Post by **downsey** » Wed May 06, 2009 4:31 pm

the only problem with a 4 speed and a 3.73 diff is that you lose power going up hills and your acceleration is slower. The 5 speed gives you the best of both worlds.

the Morris 4 speed, in my honest opinion, has some issues. I don't like the fact that 1st gear is non-synchromeshed. They arent all too reliable (think about how many posts on hear deal with bad 2nd gears). The whole time i had one in mine, i never felt sure-footed with it. The 4age is fun, but the 5 speed makes the car.

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed May 06, 2009 4:36 pm

Well - i'm finding the car still accelerates well, the higher gearing seems to suit the torque spread of my 1098 with 940 head fitted, and I can go much faster in each gear!! So overall I think it balances out. Yes I may need to go into 3rd gear on some hills - but hey ho! All these hassles of changing to a different gearbox just leave me cold. If I want 5 gears - I drive my TR7!!

Post by **downsey** » Wed May 06, 2009 4:41 pm

"If I want 5 gears - I drive my TR7!!"

Well played sir.

Post by **IslipMinor** » Wed May 06, 2009 8:19 pm

The complete conversion kit includes a new bellhousing, mounting bracket for the standard Minor release arm and mounting for the clutch x-shaft on the gearbox. Very simple and uses the complete standard RHD clutch operation. Doesn't have the restraint cable from the x-mbr to the back of the 'box, but clutch operation is excellent (6 1/2" Midget diaphragm).

You can also use the Spridget hydraulic release arm and standard Spridget hydraulic clutch operation.

The T50 Toyota box is superb, all-synchro (unbeatable), very quiet (like no gearbox noise at all), very slick change and, apart from a rather low 1st gear ratio, is very well suited to the Minor. I run a 3.9 diff and 185/70x13 tyres, which means almost 21 mph/1000 rpm in 5th. Very relaxed, and combined with a good 1380 engine, a very rare need to change down to 4th on any motorway journey.

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed May 06, 2009 9:37 pm

So - where can you get the 'complete conversion kit' ?

Post by **Mogwai** » Wed May 06, 2009 9:47 pm

from blokes on mopeds

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed May 06, 2009 9:54 pm

In this case - yes, but for less fortunate individuals ??

Post by **Mogwai** » Wed May 06, 2009 10:06 pm

I dont think anyone does the kit new anymore but places like frontline spridget used to do them & were helpfull to my brother inlaw for his A35

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed May 06, 2009 10:22 pm

http://www.mgcars.org.uk/frontline/
Looks like they do the Ford kit now. Not inexpensive!!

Post by **IslipMinor** » Wed May 06, 2009 11:59 pm

The very original kits came from Rooster Racing in Australia, and the UK kits were supplied by Minor Mania in Mill Hill, but they look to be a shadow of what they were a few years ago.

The key parts are the bell housing, clutch operating arm support bracket and the clutch relay shaft bracket. If the clutch parts are missing, then could the hydraulic conversion for the Minor be used to connect to the standard Toyota hydraulic set-up I wonder?

The x-mbr can be made quite easily and someone like Speedy Cables can make the speedo cable with the Minor/Toyota ends combination.

The clutch plate is a combination of AP drive faces and Toyota spline (for the 1275 Spridget engine it is a standard AP Racing part). I don't know about other clutches.

Post by **Longdog** » Thu May 07, 2009 6:49 am

Years ago I put in a T50 which was achieved by cutting the bell housing from a Minor gearbox and after very careful alignment welding it to the toyota bell housing rear section.It was very time consuming but worth the effort.If the box was fitted to a Midget this won't be an issue.