'She won't start....danm her!

[an_avenger]

Argh.......I went mad this morning.....stuck the keys in a turned the ignition but not a turn!!!!!

When I try to turn the engine, there seems to be a rather loud click, it sounds like some relay is clicking but the solenoid isn't turning - I checked if the engine was seized (but thank-you God) it wasn't. Me thinks the started motor is jammed, so ploped it in gear and moved it back and forward - nearly crushing my feet as the car decided to go further back than was intended, but can the car move (whilst in gear) if the solenoid is jammed?

Please, please help -

[Cam]

OK, it sounds as if your starter motor may be jammed, or your battery is very flat.

Firstly, make sure that you have not got a flat battery! (check battery voltage ~11-12v) and check brightness of lights. Also check to see if your engine to chassis earth straps are OK.

If it is the starter motor then the usual thing to try is to put it in gear and move the car forwards & backwards (a lot). But it sounds as if you have already tried this. Moving the car a little bit will not always free the starter, to make sure try pushing the car and bump starting it.

If you don't fancy that idea, you could try turning the small square drive on the back of the starter motor. This usually frees the starter. If this can turn quite freely (without turning the engine) then the starter is free of the engine.

Make sure that all the connections from the battery to the starter solenoid and from the starter solenoid to the starter motor are solidly made.

If they are then switch the lights on and try to start the car.

If the lights do not dim when trying to start the car then measure the voltage at the connection at the back of the starter.

if 11 - 12 ish volts are present when trying to start the car then the starter has an open circuit and is probably knackered.

Keep us updated!!

Cam.

[Chris Morley]

The quick clicking noise almost always means a battery with little charge. It's unlikely the starter has jammed. The quick & easy way to prove this is to use jump leads and another car / battery. I bet the starter will work fine.

Top Tip: Get a starting handle - reduces stress and AA/RAC callouts.

[Willie]

to explain the above... if the battery is very low, when you
operate the starter you get the 'click' which is the starter
solonoid operating..but,as soon as it does so the starter motor
tries to turn the engine, and drains the 'low' battery so much
that the solonoid loses all its supply and disconnects itself.
As soon as it disconnects, the battery finds enough power
to operate it again .....and so on and so on,click click click
as Cam said, if you had the headlights on they would have
faded drastically
Willie

[an_avenger]

Thanks for the info guys - my battery seems to be fine and so does the starter motor! I thought that the starter solenoid (the thing which goes 'click') might be knackard.... ....but just to give you an update. The unit which has a red push-button on the top and thick cables coming from the battery (via this unit) to the starter motor doesn't make the same 'clicking' noise as it does when I using the key! I presume this unit with the button is the solenoid starting switch?

[Willie]

Yes that is the solonoid and it should have a rubber covered
button on its underneath? if you press this it should operate
the starter. If it does then your problem is somewhere between
the ignition switch and the small connector on the solonoid,a
white wire with a red stripe. Try that
Willie

[Willie]

to refine that, if the starter works when you press the bottom
of the solonoid UP but does not work when you turn the
ignition key then run a wire from the unearthed terminal of
your battery to the terminal on the solonoid which has a
white/red wire on it. If it now works you have a problem
between the ignition switch and the white/red connection,
if it still does not work then the solonoid itself is faulty......
is it cleanly bolted to the chassis?(earthed).
Willie

[Cam]

Just a quick point guys.

My starter solenoid ('69) has it's red push button ON TOP in between the two leads, as can be seen below:



When you activate the starter (either way) does it spin and make those clicking noises or is it stationary when the clicks are heard.

The reason I ask is that if it is turning but the engine is not, then you may have broken (or very worn) teeth on either the starter motor dog, or the flywheel ring gear. Or the starter motor is very loose!!

[Willie]

I have sold my 1967 saloon so cannot physically check
and my 1957 is too early to have a solonoid, but my
solonoid had a red button on the top AND a rubber
doughnut on the bottom which operated the switch if
pressed....You never know what parts came from where
with our old cars. I assumed it was standard issue?? It
makes no difference to the testing procedure though.
Willie

[Cam]

Willie,

No, it makes absolutely no difference to the testing, I just thought I would post the piccy in case there was any confusion.

And like you say, you never know with our cars!!

[an_avenger]

Yes 'Cam' that's it! No it doesn't turn the engine either when the red button is pressed or if the key ignition is engaged! So presumably it will need replacing?

This is so humiliating, my two housemates are owners and members of the Austin Rover Maestro owners club. Always when something goes wrong on 'Pidge' they press me to sell her and get a Meastro!! OVER MY DEAD BODY!

[Cam]

Before you bin your starter, check to see if you have voltage present at the starter connection (connect a bulb from it to earth if you don't have a meter).

When trying to start the car:

If the bulb lights, then your starter is duff.

If the bulb does not light then your starter solenoid is duff.

Assuming that you have checked everything mentioned above.

It is quite amazing that your housemates admit to being in the Austin Rover Maestro owners club!! I owned a 1.3 HLS (C reg) for about a month which I bought from my mate for £1! which I then stripped for bits.

Mind you, I once knew a lad who was in the Allegro Owner's club!! No accounting for taste is there?

[Willie]

Just a thought.........do you happen to have the type of battery
connection which is a cap which fits onto the battery terminal
and is secured by a self tapping screw?????????????????
If yes this type is notorious for going 'high resistance' I.e.
it will pass sufficient to light the headlights but will NOT pass
enough to start the car! You should always use the type
which is a CLAMP around the battery post and is secured by
a nut and bolt. earlier I said run a (thin)wire from the battery
unearthed side to the white/red wire on the solonoid when the
solonoid should operate...have you tried this??If so what was
the result?
Willie

[les]

Oi watch it Cam, I owned an allegro and I'd have another!

[Cam]

Les,

There's nowt wrong with Allegros!! Actually, I quite like them too

I have a soft spot for pretty much any BMC/Leyland/Austin/Morris/etc. car as my family seem to have pretty much gone through the collection!!!

My first cars were two Austin 1100s that my grandad gave me (dumped in my back garden) when I was about 8 (showing my age now!!). I managed to strip quite a lot off them considering my tender years, although I could not put them back together!!! (no change there then!!).

Ahh.......memories.........

[les]

All light hearted stuff Cam, but i'm sure there are people out there who say they dont like Allegros because its the done thing! Without wanting to use this moggy board as an allegro platform I must say it was one of the most reliable cars i've owned and they could be run on a shoestring, but not tax free! Still, must think minor while i'm here.

[Cam]

Les,

The point is that the Allegro still followed the same formula as it's predecessors which made it a bit dated compared to the competition, but in my opinion this was a good thing. It was only the Maestro/Montego era and beyond that ruined it for me.

Even though the '70s were supposed to be the UK car industry's dark era, there were still some damn fine cars produced then (in my opinion anyway). And I would still prefer to drive around in a Maxi/Allegro/Marina/Princess than a Focus/Astra/Primera/eurobox.

This probably classifies me as needing professional help, but I know what I like and I don't care.

Although, given the choice an early 50's car (preferably a Minor) would be nice!!! .......next project???? hope so!!!

[an_avenger]

IT WAS THE SOLENOID AFTER ALL But it was a damn bu@@er to get a hold of one......total cost £29 from my local motor factor! So now 'Pidge' is back on the move...... Thanks guys

[Willie]

Just a thought.. with all of your starting troubles it would,
of course, have been easy to start the car on the starting
handle.....you never mentioned using it?? There are very
few cars on the road nowadays which can be started by
hand,we are very lucky.
Willie

[an_avenger]

Hello

I've never tried to start it with the handle (I've heard you can take your thumb off and it causes damage? ) I dunno if thats a myth! But how do you crank? if I mind asking.......ooooh err?