Anti-freeze

Post by **d_harris** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:36 am

Wouldn't worry about that too much. The minor is stupidly overcooled anyway. In colder climes then its probabally better to blank part of the rad

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 12:10 pm

Take the fan off - and save some power too! Used to be v common to have an adjustable radiator blind in front of the rad - or sometimes a 'muff' that fitted on the grille bars!

Post by **MikeNash** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 11:27 pm

Re the mix ratio, for what its worth when I was a wee lad in the 60s and skiving off to read ancient test notes in the RAE Farnboro' library, I came across 1930s trials to get the optimum mix for RR Merlins. Apparently 60:40 (water: glycol) gave the best heat transference from the engine by balancing the high specific heat of water (ie its ability to aborb lots of heat per unit vol/wt) and the reduced viscosity gained fom the glycol which allowed more to be propelled thro' the engine by a given pump.

And I think that from steam tables our 4 lb/sq in radiator caps give us a boiling point of 104C, so definitely go for a high temp thermostat - I use an 89C piece (and am thinking of a 91C one. Anyone using these?)
Regards, MikeN.

Post by **rayofleamington** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 11:38 pm

Hmmm - my 1098 hasn't had anti-freeze in it for 8 years now !

that's probably doing your engine more harm than your 99p/litre engine oil! I guess that it won't matter too much as you never get far in it, but if you used it for 10 to 15k per year you'd have already regretted the lack of antifreeze years ago!

The better antifreezes that are now available give an improved heat transfer cpompared to 10 years ago (however I've no idea how to choose between one and another when comparing containers on a shelf). Working in powertrain we get to hear the occasional useless fact like that. For any car that's been made since 2000 you may be better off sticking to the main dealer antifreeze, as long as their prices are not astronomic.
Any antifreeze is certainly better than none - all year round.

Post by **MikeNash** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:49 am

Hmmm,
99p a litre, Ray? Adsa's oil at £4.25 a can is only 85p a litre. Personally, I don't see the need to go for that dear stuff, Ray.

Post by **Kevin** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 12:07 pm

99p a litre, Ray?
Personally, I don't see the need to go for that dear stuff, Ray.

That`s dear

Post by **bmcecosse** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:30 pm

The cost of the oil is not too important - it doesn't burn or leak any significant amount - but I do religously change it every two years whether it needs it or not! Since it's in a nice warm garage and doesn't go out when there is SALT about - it's been fine with no antifreeze! The same water has been in there for a long time - so any dissolved oxygen will be long gone - and so it will be neutral pH by now. Idea there - I'm sure I have some litmus paper somewhere !!

Post by **Sidney'61** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:41 pm

So does it matter what type of anti-freeze you use? eg. is there a certain make that's best to go for?
I read on a bottle in Halfords earlier 'Suitable for most engines built after 1998' how would it make a difference?

Post by **bmcecosse** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:49 pm

They are all Glycol based these days. Just look for the best buy - but make sure you are not buying 'ready diluted' stuff - unless the price is right of course!

Post by **Sidney'61** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:59 pm

bmcecosse wrote:make sure you are not buying 'ready diluted' stuff - unless the price is right of course!

Ah yes, a clever trick that one. Kinda like Asda orange squash, dillute it a bit more but still sell it for the same price and hope no-one notices

Post by **bmcecosse** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:09 am

Even better trick is 'bottled water' !! Can't get my head round that one - but of course, maybe not everywhere in UK has nice clear fresh Scottish Water, with just a touch of cryptosporidium for added flavour!

Post by **Luxobarge** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 11:34 am

bmcecosse wrote:Even better trick is 'bottled water' !! Can't get my head round that one - but of course, maybe not everywhere in UK has nice clear fresh Scottish Water, with just a touch of cryptosporidium for added flavour!

Couldn't agree more!

I've been to remote tribal villages in Africa, which are so primitive that they have to carry their drinking water back to their homes for miles, in plastic containers.

Now we'd never dream of doing that in Britain, would we????

Talking of water for antifreeze, I use distilled water from my de-humidifier, as it is purer, and has less ions that promote corrosion. However, another source of distilled water is the ice that has condensed inside your home freezer - next time you defrost, keep the melted ice! I've used this in batteries too. Especially useful if you live in a hard-water area...

Worth filtering out the stray peas etc. from it though I suppose

Post by **Sidney'61** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:55 pm

Luxobarge wrote: I've been to remote tribal villages in Africa, which are so primitive that they have to carry their drinking water back to their homes for miles, in plastic containers.

Now we'd never dream of doing that in Britain, would we????

We had to do that for few weeks in Northampton a couple of months ago. They issued a warning that our tap water was too full of cryptosporidium so we weren't allowed to drink it.
Most shops sold out of bottled water.
I have to say though it was quite funny watching fully grown adults in a supermarket fighting over the last bottle of water

Oops slightly off topic here!

Post by **eastona** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:41 pm

I have just fitted my 88deg winter thermostat, a much warmer heater this morning, nice and toasty.

I'll fitting the radiator muff soon too, I just need to do it without scratching the newly painted

dilute to taste

Indeed, a simple test to determine the concentration of anti freeze in your rad

Andrew

Post by **polo2k** » Tue Nov 04, 2008 6:49 pm

With reference to the modern coolants. I think that the "1998" reference is do do with construction materials.
There are some coolants you cannot mix!
i.e. Vw used to use a green coolant, they now use a pink coolant, mix them and you get something the consistancy of hair gel!!!
Im sure Ive read in a vintage manual that you can just use Glycerene. I suppose that might be good for the hoses too as it would "moisturise" them. (I apologise in advance for the concourse judges sniffing coolant next year lol) ;)

Heres an interesting thought... could a light-ish oil be used, maybe 50:50 diesel and 20/50? presumambly the hoses would need sorting first and the fumes might be a bit nasty but there wouldnt be any corrosion.
Does anyone know how the thermal effcency of water compares to various oils? at various viscosities?

Post by **Sidney'61** » Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:09 pm

polo2k wrote:Does anyone know how the thermal effcency of water compares to various oils? at various viscosities?

Can't say I've ever thought about it

Post by **Luxobarge** » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:00 pm

Can't think of a commonly available liquid that has a higher heat capacity than water, by quite a long way - it's extrordinary stuff, the old common H2O, shame it rusts things though isn't it?

Post by **PSL184** » Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:02 pm

Try water with salt added - higher heat capacity and higher rustyness factor !!!!

Post by **bmcecosse** » Wed Nov 05, 2008 11:57 am

But water - once de-oxygenated by boiling - really doesn't promote rust! Once you have that 88 stat in place eastona - there is NO point fitting a rad muff. The stat will hold the engine temperature very precisely.

Post by **Stig** » Wed Nov 05, 2008 1:19 pm

bmcecosse wrote:But water - once de-oxygenated by boiling - really doesn't promote rust! Once you have that 88 stat in place eastona - there is NO point fitting a rad muff. The stat will hold the engine temperature very precisely.

I find mine runs a bit better in the winter with half the radiator blanked off, it's always preferred a warmer air temperature despite physics (warmer = less dense intake). I'm also running an 88C stat all year round.