King Pins

Post by **londonboy** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 12:28 am

Hi this might seem a silly thing to ask but could any one give me some idea about how to change both king pins on a 1971 two door Morris minor. My mine have fae bit of ware in them but I have two good ones to replace them with.Thanks for any help given

Post by **MoggyTech** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 2:13 am

Jack up front of car and support on axle stands
Remove wheels.
Remove brake back plate complete and tie out of the way
Remove tie bar
Use a scissors or bottle jack, and jack up rear part of the two piece wishbone, making sure jack cannot slip.
Remove front portion of the wishbone
Remove outer pivot pin from lower trunnion.
Lower scissors jack slowly to release the tension in the torsion bar.
Crack off track rod end from steering arm joint.
Remove nuts for top trunnion pin to kingpin,
remove kingpin.

Probably a good time to replace all the bushes in the suspension, so consider removing torsion bar for access to the inner eyebolt bushes.

Poly bushes last a lot longer, but give a slightly harder ride.

Repeat for other side.

If your new kingpins don't have steering arms fitted, be aware the old ones can be an absolute pig to get put of the old kingpins. Much heat and bashing usually required.

When all back together, have steering geometry checked/adjusted. 2.5mm toe in, zero camber to 1 degree negative camber.

Post by **rayofleamington** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 1:24 pm

whilst doing the king pins it's a good idea to do the eyebolt pin and bushes. I on;y use poly bushes for the eyebolt as I've had 'standard' (new replacement rubbish) ones wear through in a year

Post by **aupickup** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:27 pm

and of course not forgetting to remove the front hubs

Post by **MoggyTech** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 3:53 pm

Speaking of Kingpins, IIRC most suppliers have now been out of stock for 9 months! Pretty sorry state of affairs if you ask me.

Post by **bmcecosse** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 3:56 pm

Anyone coming up with a Macpherson strut type conversion to replace the king pins ? I know there is a coil spring/wishbone conversion - but it's quite a job to install.

Post by **jonathon** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 4:16 pm

Its not too bad a job to install BM.,as it still uses most of the original Minor parts. We are currently building a double wishbone system, doing away with the top lever arm.
Macpherson's are a poor second in my opinion as the double wishbone is much stronger and tunable, plus the fact that to fit a Macpherson you will need to strengthen up the whole inner wing, encroaching on both engine and ancillary room, even if staying with the good o'l A series.
The king pins are still a 'good' design and can withstand huge loadings, and if regularly maintained ,will last for ages.

Post by **bmcecosse** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 4:33 pm

I know J - I was giving you a way 'in'! But folks do fit Mac P struts on Minis without too much hassle - I would have thought a turret fitted into the inner wing area - probably with a cross-brace and retaining the lower arm/tie-bar and torsion bar wouldn't be too difficult to arrange ?

Post by **jonathon** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 4:41 pm

But the inner wing and tie plate are unsupported items and will not offer the structural strength on which to graft in a turret. We have looked at this as a possibility but decided to go double wishbone as its far easier to integrate into the existing Minor structure.

Post by **Dominic** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:42 pm

Does anyone know why the supply of kingpins has dried up so completely? More importantly, does anyone know when they are likely to be back in supply? (I'm after the offside one)
Dom

Post by **aupickup** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:54 pm

simple all stocks used up

to many moggies

Post by **bmcecosse** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 8:05 pm

New ones were made in France recently - and then 'failed' on crack testing. I doubt the originals were ever crack tested!!

Post by **jonathon** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:12 pm

The kingpins that failed were actually made in good o'l China. These were found to be very poor quality once the machining process was started, shown in air pockets and bad layering. From what I can glean these are now being re forged in Turkey, with a promise date of next month, but then we have had this promise before.
I'm looking into the cost of reproduction at some British foundaries and our local engineering company. The limiting factor being quantity, as the forgers are more than likely to need an order for a few hundred of either side. This as you can imagine will be a huge financial commitment, for just ourselves to contemplate, so we can either go for high quality low production runs, with an obvious higher asking price or leave it to the 'big hitters in the market, who so far have shown their cards for wanting a cheap product and high profit margin.
I only hope ,and I'm sure they will, be good quality items from Turkey

Post by **MoggyTech** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:58 pm

How come the major suppliers are calling these Kingpins 'Genuine MOWOG' if they are cast in bloomin' China! Everything that comes out of China is cheap tat. Now I'm really miffed.

Post by **minor_hickup** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:10 pm

They were never sold so never called 'genuine MOWOG'. They could be called genuine MOWOG if they used the original tooling. Just like heritage panels being sold as 'genuine' replacement parts.

Jonathon, I would be extremely interested to see the price on a small run of kingpins. From experience I know how much cast and machined pieces cost to make in relatively small numbers, albeit not kingpins for morrises! The only way these items are ever going to be cost effective and of an acceptable quality is for these items to be produced in relatively large batches and used by most of the suppliers.

Post by **jonathon** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:11 pm

I don't think that they are marked MOWOG any more. Not too sure as to whether there are two avenues of manufacture of these items or we are being spun a yarn or two

Post by **minor_hickup** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:15 pm

I don't think anyone is being 'spun a yarn'. Just a lot of rumours from people who don't know what's going on. As usual no one needs to reveal their suppliers and so people take a guess at the situation.

Post by **MoggyTech** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:15 pm

jonathon wrote:I don't think that they are marked MOWOG any more. Not too sure as to whether there are two avenues of manufacture of these items or we are being spun a yarn or two

Well the two main suppliers still list them as MOWOG parts Jonothan. So I wonder where their cheaper alternatives come from. Hmmm, I can see me making a few phone calls soon

Post by **jonathon** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:23 pm

As far as I know there is only one supplier. M Hickup, are you privy to info that we are not then?

Post by **minor_hickup** » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:26 pm

I really wouldn't like to speculate more than to say I don't think there there is any big conspiracy. I know the parts supply is frustrating sometimes but thats usually because of the relatively small quantities needed for our cars, large in terms of classic cars in general but small compared to much of the manufacturing industry as a whole.