Tie Rod problems

[Matt]

Ahh well I have some blue ones now... but I still cant see how there would be enough force in the appropraite direction to force the washer down the shaft... think about the twist there must have been at the eyebolt when it happened

[bigginger]

Pothole/kerb?
a

[Matt]

but that would push the wheel backwards and try to compress the front bush...

The only way I can think of to compress the rear is sudden braking/hitting something hard in reverse... which I havent done :s

[bigginger]

I thought I had the reason all clear, but on reflection, yes, once again I'm talking out of my rear.
a

[MoggyTech]

but that would push the wheel backwards and try to compress the front bush...

The only way I can think of to compress the rear is sudden braking/hitting something hard in reverse... which I havent done :s

It is a bit of a mystery Matt. It's more likely to have been gradual wear rather than sudden forces. The only transient loading I can think of, is when you release the brakes, the vehicles body G loading returns to normal and the weight distribution is decreased on the front wheels. The wheels however weigh about 22Lbs each and are rotating forwards, so I would expect some gyroscopic forces to be pushing forward, if only briefly.

While the wheels gyroscopic forces are pretty much balanced out, due to half the wheel rotating rearwards, you have to figure in tyre friction on the road surface, which is generated by the cars weight, plus the tyre gripping the road due to rotational forces.

All you can really do, is check the kingpin inclination, which should be 7 to 7.5 degrees. The geometry is pretty much fixed by the position of the Armstrong dampers on the bulkhead, and the eyebolt location on the chassis leg, which sets the kingpin inclination angle.

Or, do you reverse over a high kerb at all?

[Matt]

Nope! no high kerbs (or any kerbs come to that!)

I will put it back together with my blue bushes and see what happens

[bmcecosse]

I can't see how the bushes were forced back - there should be a huge (relatively!) disc plate on the rod ! Maybe in the past someone has swapped the front bushes to rear and vice versa. Anyway - new bushes and it should be fine!

[Matt]

there is such a plate BMC, thats been forced down the rod along with the bushes

[bmcecosse]

Ahhh - now that plate should be welded in place - it's not supposed to be moveable! There's the problem. How it's happened - no idea. Just weld them back where they should be - or use another pair of tie-rods.

[bigginger]

Are you certain of that? I've yet to find one where it was welded on, and am aware that there were differences in the tie bars - no split pin hole on some, for example.
a

[bmcecosse]

Ahh - maybe mine were just welded with RUST! I work more with Minis - and they are certainly welded in place. But the bushes on a Minor will do nothing if these plates can move along the rod - so if they were originally just held by a shoulder, and it's now gone, then welding or new rods and plates will be the only answer!

[bigginger]

Agreed - whatever's worn needs replacing, though I guess welding might do the job. It's just I'd be reluctant to put the necessary heat into the rod, for fear of affecting its strength
a

[bmcecosse]

I would weld it - but not let it get too hot - just do a bit at a time on alternate rods. As long as it's not quenched it should be fine.

[aupickup]

originally not welded of course, there is a shoulder on the tie rod

[bmcecosse]

Yes - it's coming back to me -mine would just be rusted in place -whereas the Mini rod has a heavy disc/plate that is welded to the rod, but with the front wheel drive there is much more effort to be resisted!