Honda VTEC engine swap

Post by **lowedb** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 7:42 am

Isn't the Honda a front wheel drive? If so you'd have to use a different gearbox than the one that comes with it, and I don't think the Minor box would take the torque, even if you could get them to mate up.

Post by **Cam** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 11:21 am

If you could find an in-line gearbox to mate to the Honda engine you might be able to turn it round, although (if it fits lengthways) you would have to make custom engine and gearbox mounts. Plus the in-line gearbox would probably be a lot bigger than the Minor's original 'box so you might have to move the steering rack and replace it with a front low type as opposed to the Minor's rear high type. This would probably mean replacing the front stub axle assemblies / steering arms and making up some custom steering gear to mate the steering column to the new rack at it's new location.

Then you would have to replace the rear axle for one that would take the Honda engine's power output and get a custom prop made.

Nice idea for a project car, but certainly NOT a simple swap job.

Post by **Innovator** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 8:45 pm

Check out June 2003 issue of Grassroots Motorsport Mag. It has a Honda engined Spitfire feartured.

Most Honda engines turn the "wrong way" so you would end up with lots of reverse gears unless you turned the fiff upside down!!

John

Post by **Kevin** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 4:14 pm

so you would end up with lots of reverse gears unless you turned the fiff upside down!!

Hmmm sounds a bit like a Beardmore project

idea to me, especially the fiff

Post by **P-J** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 4:42 pm

Post by **Kevin** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 5:08 pm

Maybe, but I doubt it have a look at their website
http://www.beardmorebros.co.uk

Post by **Cam** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 5:44 pm

Yes, that is a very good point that John made, if it turns the wrong way then you are a bit knackered!

And I'm sure he was being comical when he was talking about turning the diff upside down!

This works on scrap-heap challenge but I'm not sure that it would work in the real world, as the breather would have to be blanked off and a new one drilled out on the other side. Also the hypoid gears would be at the top and not the bottom, so would probably suffer a bit of oil starvation, not to mention being a lot closer to the chassis than is healthy!! (due to the hypoid offset).

Post by **Innovator** » Fri Aug 29, 2003 8:00 pm

Whoops, spelling mistake, F is next to d on the key board and my big fingers keep hitting the wrong key!

I need a large keyboard.

John

PS The way round the oiling an upside down diff is to have a pump and squirt oil directly at the required points.

Post by **Cam** » Sat Aug 30, 2003 1:18 am

PS The way round the oiling an upside down diff is to have a pump and squirt oil directly at the required points

Cunning as a weasel!!

Post by **rayofleamington** » Fri Sep 05, 2003 5:49 pm

reversing the diff is a nice trick, but the gearbox would probably soon fail (on account of running backwards and not lubricating properly and loading etc..)

Safest bet is to take a look at the Honda engine compared to a 'normal' car. Honda make a lot of Backwards engines but they do make both!!
I think if the gearbox on a FWD is on the right, (when standing infront of the car, leaning over the engine bay..) then it should be the right rotation [only a guess]. Honda's have gearboxes on each side which in my very limited experience seems to tie up with rotation direction.

Post by **Innovator** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 1:10 pm

The S2000 engine spins the correct way and is RWD. A magazine in the states fitted one to a Spitfire (waste of a good engine!!)

John

Post by **Cam** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 1:24 pm

A 240 BHP DOHC VTEC out of this car:

and put in this car:

Could prove VERY interesting!!

Post by **rayofleamington** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 1:45 pm

you could of course leave the Honda engine in the Honda, and leave the minor engine in the minor.
My Civic's double wishbone front suspension seems more suited to the Honda power, and likewise with the kingpin arrangement and the 1098. Or am I just getting old?
Nice to know someone is still making donor cars tho.

As for Wako29, I would suggest to look on the UK ebay for a Minor or Marina drivetrain, then pay for a shipper to the US.

Post by **Cam** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 2:24 pm

I agree with leaving the Minor engine in the Minor but the Honda engine needs to be in a better car (like a Minor!). I peronally like driving a standard Minor but I can't say that I like driving modern Hondas. My dad has a '94 Civic ESI and it is SO dull. Handles well, reasonable power, but just so DULL!

I think you are getting old mate!

Far more interesting to put loads of power in a Minor and make it handle a bit better.

I like standard AND modified Minors and could never make up my mind which I prefer, so best to have both and then choose when the mood takes you, but I must admit that after driving Jane's car this week I am liking the standard one more and more............

Post by **rayofleamington** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 2:36 pm

but I must admit that after driving Jane's car this week I am liking the standard one more and more

I know the feeling. There's much to be said about the joys of a standard Minor. Except that the top end gearing is poor for the motorway..

Post by **Cam** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 2:48 pm

the top end gearing is poor for the motorway..

Yes, I noticed that, but it seemed to like 60 OK and started getting a bit noisy at 70+. At 45 it was as sweet as a nut! not like my noisy thing!

I think when my Rover finally dies next year I will get a standard Moggy and keep it standard, but I need to drive a 948 in the mean time to comapre it to the 1098 before I make my decision as I fancy a series 3 at the moment, but I'll have to see how practical it would be compared to the 1098 which I now know is adequate.

Post by **rayofleamington** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:28 pm

A standard 948 is a fantastic car - really quiet and smooth.

It hasn't quite got the guts of the 1098 but if you don't mind driving on long runs at 60 to 65 instead of 65 to 70 then it's a tough call.

My 58 ex-disabled car is presently built with 948 running gear so am looking forward to getting it on the road one day.
My 62 4 door also used to do 45mpg - I've never had more than low 30's from a 1098

But maybe you should have a series 3 traveller?? the extra power might come in useful if you're going to be carting engines and gearboxes around?

Post by **Cam** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:47 pm

Yes, I had seriously considered a series 3 traveller, but the 948's lack of torque concerned me a little (especially if I am carting stuff about!), but if you say there's not much in it then it should be OK. All the same, I would not mind a drive of one before this time next year.

Post by **Peetee** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 10:05 pm

Yes, I had seriously considered a series 3 traveller, but the 948's lack of torque concerned me a little (especially if I am carting stuff about!),

Cam, we have talked about Denzil a lot and I can emphasise that it has lost none of it's 948 smoothness and gained plenty of power. Hopefully I will soon be in the position to compare it with a 1098 and will write a piece about the modifications I made and post it on this group.
Denzil is off with his new owner to the Isle of Wight tomorrow. I tried to keep hold of the 12G295 gas flowed head but the buyer insisted that I wouldn't have a sale if I did.
Never mind, You can't have your cake and eat it.

Morris Minor Owners Club

Honda VTEC engine swap

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Vtec Engine