Squeaky Steering

Post by **Cam** » Sun Aug 24, 2003 10:10 pm

For a few months now, my steering started squeaking when turning the wheel. I thought at first it might be the top steering column bush, so today I removed it and it was OK, in fact I removed the top tube (steering column outer) from the dashboard mountings after oiling it (for the bottom bush) and the squeak was still there with it rotating along with the column!

So it must be coming from the floor area or the rack. I pumped some EP90 into the rack (the grease gun used about 1 inch by 1 inch of oil) and lubricated the area just below the pinch bolt in the floor in case anything was catching. I also checked that the parcel shelf was not catching and it isn't, but the squeak is still there.

This has me confused now. Could it be the rack itself or is there some other explanation.

I don’t know if it’s me but the steering does seem to get slightly stiffer when it's squeaking.

Any opinions?

Post by **57traveller** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 8:09 am

Horn slip ring and earth contact?

Post by **Cam** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 11:14 am

Nope, that was all stripped down with the indicator arm assembly removed, so it wasn't that. Any other ideas?

Post by **57traveller** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 1:33 pm

Does the noise definitely seem to come from column or rack area? I know it's a pain but might it be worth disconnecting the trackrod ends from the steering arms, individually, and turning the steering wheel? Noises in cars sometimes transmit quite dramatically. Even if the "squeak" remains the possible problem will at least be pinpointed to rack or column area.

On the subject of noises, my Traveller's engine is developing one that is very easy to diagnose - big end(s)

Post by **Cam** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 5:08 pm

Oh dear! sorry to hear about your traveller's engine, but it's not the end of the world (even if it seems so at the moment!).

I have disconnected the column so all that is connected is the pinch bolt at the floor end, so it can't be the column any more. It has to be either the rack or something I have not considered. Any other ideas other than the rack? and do they make a squeaking noise? I have never had one make that noise before which is why I thought it might have been the column which it isn't.

Post by **57traveller** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 5:32 pm

So if the column is silent when disconnected from the rack it probably would be worth releasing the trackrod ends with the rack connected to the column. If the squeak is there it must be rack related. If all's silent then it's further down the line. Reconnecting one trackrod end and turning the steering then the other will determine which side the noise comes from. Does that make sense?! Never encountered a noisy rack but there's always a first time for most things.

Bottom end noise not terminal YET but don't think it will be long until surgery is needed.

Post by **Cam** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 5:47 pm

Yeah, thanks for that, I'll give it a go

Post by **Willie** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 8:03 pm

I have experienced a squeaky track rod end on a different
sort of car,of course it was a sealed for life type, wouldn't
expect a squeak from one with a grease nipple! It was
identified by dribbling oil on it which cured the squeak pretty
quickly.

Post by **Cam** » Mon Aug 25, 2003 9:56 pm

Was it really noticable from inside the car? Mine sounds like it was coming from the steering column but I now know that is not the case.

I might have a look (and listen) at the track rod ends first then just to make sure.

Post by **57traveller** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 8:56 am

One thing that sprung to mind re disconnecting the trackrod ends is that most of the load has been removed from the system so if it is the rack it may not squeak then anyway!

Post by **Cam** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 12:14 pm

Good point, I will try it just with the front wheels off the ground first, then with one track rod end disconnected, then the other. This should hopefully 'track' down the problem (pun fully intended!

)

If the squeak disappears with just the wheels off the ground (and everything still connected) then I will continue the testing with the wheels ON the ground.

Post by **Kevin** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 3:46 pm

Cam are you using a second set of ears at the same time to help in pinpointing the sound as its one of those things that a second person can assist with turning the wheel while you investigate (head under the car position etc) you can try magnifying the sound by using a screwdriver dont know if this will work the same as tracking down engine noises but may be worth a go.

Post by **Cam** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 5:35 pm

Thanks Kevin, I was doing it on my own but maybe a helper is need. The trouble is that it is the sort of noise that is really difficult to pinpoint. Like I said before, I thought it was the column, but I was way out!

Post by **Cam** » Sat Aug 30, 2003 1:14 am

Just an update on the squeaky problem!

I raised the front of the car on axle stands and turned the steering wheel. Squeak still there and it does get stiffer when it is squeaking.

I also noticed that the EP90 that I had pumped into the rack a few days ago has now all run out all over my garage floor!

I took both road wheels off and disconnected one track rod end - result? still squeaks! So I disconnected the other end - result? still squeaks!!

So I took the rack out and put it in the vice and lo and behold the squeak has transfered from the car to the vice!

I also noticed that the near side gaiter had split (which explains the leaking EP90) but it started squeaking BEFORE it's last MOT, so I would guess that the gaiter had split a while ago (loosing all the oil) and that's what caused the excessive wear which in turn caused the squeak and tightness. The MOT bloke must have missed the split gaiter.

Anyway, I am not happy with the rack's functioning at the moment as it has tight spots so I am presuming internal damage. I will get a reconditioned one tomorrow from the Birmingham Minor centre as well as two new track rod ends while I am at it. More expense but I prefer the peace of mind.

Post by **Kevin** » Sat Aug 30, 2003 3:01 am

Well something else for me to remember there then Cam, for steering squeaks check that the gaiters have not split

Post by **57traveller** » Sat Aug 30, 2003 2:17 pm

Glad you found the source Cam, the split gaiter has probably allowed the ingress of rubbish which has destroyed the rack seal and hence the oil to leak out.

Post by **Cam** » Sun Aug 31, 2003 2:22 pm

I have fitted the new rack, but I am unsure as to the lubrication requirements. I would presume that it does not need any at the moment as it is brand new (but I put a few squirts in anyway just incase).

What is confusing me a bit is that the manual states that it needs 10 fl oz on rebuilding (1/2 pint) which it should already have, but every 12,000 miles it should have up to 10 squirts from the grease gun (filled with EP90). I have a few different sized grease guns, so exactly how much is 10 squirts in liquid measure??

Also it says 'UP TO 10 squirts' so how do you tell when you have put enough in? and what happens if you overfill?

This is the first time that I have fitted a new rack so I am a bit in the dark and want to get it right (so I don't blow any seals or have the thing wear due to under lubrication).

Lots of opinions would be gratefully accepted!!

Post by **Willie** » Mon Sep 01, 2003 7:07 pm

Don't know if there is a standard amount of 'squirt' from
say,all lever type grease guns,but i doubt it because you
pump grease until it exudes from the joints so you have a
visual check. If you seriously overfill the steering rack
with oil then it will,of course, force its way around the
rack gaiters or even split them so I suppose you make sure
that they don't start to feel 'pumped up'?

Post by **Kevin** » Tue Sep 02, 2003 1:27 am

Cam the BMC manual states
Care must be taken to not overlubricate the rack since the excess oil is forced into the bellows and may cause them to burst when the steering is on full lock !!!!!
The type of gun suggested is the small hand type not the lever type, but this still does not say when is there enough in there, so I will ask a couple of Minor Specialists and see if there is some common ground.

Post by **57traveller** » Tue Sep 02, 2003 2:51 pm

I'm open to correction here but surely the gaiters are only fitted to keep muck out and not oil in just the same as where drive shafts are fitted (eg front wheel drive) surely there are lip type oil seals or "o" rings fitted to do that job. The steering rod ends of all my gaiters move on the rods if pushed hard enough and no oil leaks out in spite of regular specified lubrication.
Yes if oil leaks into the gaiters and they are fully tight then any time they compress on full lock may cause them to burst. Thats probably why Cam's has split.