Front end rattle

[myoldjalopy]

I had a rattle/knock at the front and after much deliberation replaced the steering rack with a reconditioned one. Now the o/s is quiet but the n/s still has a rattle/knock. I can't see anything that might cause it - any ideas?

[geoberni]

Depends how long you've had it, where on the 'front end' it is actually coming from (or seems to), and the severity/tone/pitch of the noise.
It could be anything from the rubber grommet on the bonnet release to something more severe.
You've been around a long while, how about some more details.....

[ManyMinors]

Have you checked the shock absorber mounting bolts?

[myoldjalopy]

OK guys, a knock/rattle manifests itself after driving over bumps, potholes etc. and *seems* to come from the front passenger footwell area, but hard to pinpoint exactly when driving. I can't replicate it with the car stationary. It is definitely not from the bonnet and has been there quite a while. There didn't seem to be wear in the front suspension which is why I thought it was the rack, and indeed, the old rack was worn and the rattle stopped in the driver's side but not the other.
As for the damper bolts, they were a little loose and have been tightened, but one of the bolts would not tighten as the thread in the captive plate must have gone. I would have thought three bolts would be OK, but maybe not?

[ManyMinors]

I would say that the manufacturer fitted 4 bolts because they felt 4 bolts were required?
If you have a rattle somewhere and you know that something is not secured properly, then that is the first place to start? It might not be that but those mounting bolts have been a known weakness in the Morris Minor for many many years

[stuffedpike20]

Could the rattle be loose steering rack mounting bolts on the passenger side?

[stuffedpike20]

Or flapping exhaust heat shield?

Or exhaust fouling bodywork?

[geoberni]

It might be that missing Damper bolt...

Late last year, I had a strange knock on my Ford Kuga, after changing the front Discs and Callipers, following a jammed Piston incident...
It wasn't all the time, but occasionally if changing direction, ie. if backing off the drive and them moving off forward, or arriving at a car park and reversing into a slot, there would be a single dull 'knock' from front driver's side as I moved in the changed direction...
I even asked advice from my local garage who does all my MOTs and any other jobs beyond my DIY abilities. He couldn't locate anything after putting in up on the ramps and doing a full MOT style check on the Drivers side.
His advice, wait for it to get more frequent and look at it again.
Some weeks later, I went over every bolt disturbed in replacing the brakes and there was one bolt on the Calliper/Carrier that moved about 1/16th of a turn when given a good heave with a spanner. The carrier must've been moving against it's bolts by only have 1 of 2 fully tightened.

So just perhaps that missing bolt is allowing some movement.

[myoldjalopy]

OK thanks guys. It is not the exhaust hitting the bodywork - I know that noise well from previous experience!
A few things to check now, but if it is the loose damper bolt, how can that be rectified? I don't know how inaccessible the captive plate is and I'm thinking the solution is a longer bolt with a nut tightened over the captive plate. Or is there another way?

[jaekl]

If the three bolts are tight, it's unlikely the shock is moving. However, they are being stressed more. My first Minor only had two bolts in one of the shocks. One day they both broke but a short stub remained in the hole enough to limp home. Early on the learning curve. The lower trunnion pin can also be a source of noise if the body of it is longer than trunnion.

[stuffedpike20]

OK thanks guys. It is not the exhaust hitting the bodywork - I know that noise well from previous experience!
A few things to check now, but if it is the loose damper bolt, how can that be rectified? I don't know how inaccessible the captive plate is and I'm thinking the solution is a longer bolt with a nut tightened over the captive plate. Or is there another way?

Would that mean cutting a hole in the inner wing?

If you are prepared to do that, a longer bolt with a nut might be the way to go.
I don't think the captive plate is very thick, so something like a helicoil is probably not possible.

[neilmorey]

It sounds like a similar noise my car had, it was fixed after replacing the tie rod bushes.

I'm sure there is a note on this forum about using a polybush and a rubber bush on either side.

Found it easily. viewtopic.php?t=69093

[philthehill]

Regarding the missing damper bolt/damaged threads :-
There is no easy access to the threaded plate in the crossmember.
I had a similar problem with my Ser 2.
Upon taking ownership of the car I found that the N/S/F damper mount bolt thread was stripped. So I cut a very small aperture in the inner wing to gain access to the inside of the cross member and used a longer bolt nut and spring washer. The access aperture after fitting the longer bolt was covered with a small patch which was located and secured by self tapping screws so as to facilitate future access if required. The patch was covered in sealant to ensure that no crud got inside the cross member. The repair was successful and serviceable way after I sold the car several thousand miles later.

[stuffedpike20]

You could take the opportunity to squirt some cavity wax through the aperture too.

[myoldjalopy]

Regarding the missing damper bolt/damaged threads :-
There is no easy access to the threaded plate in the crossmember.
I had a similar problem with my Ser 2.
Upon taking ownership of the car I found that the N/S/F damper mount bolt thread was stripped. So I cut a very small aperture in the inner wing to gain access to the inside of the cross member and used a longer bolt nut and spring washer. The access aperture after fitting the longer bolt was covered with a small patch which was located and secured by self tapping screws so as to facilitate future access if required. The patch was covered in sealant to ensure that no crud got inside the cross member. The repair was successful and serviceable way after I sold the car several thousand miles later.

Thanks Phil, so there's no other way of accessing the captive plate than cutting the inner wing?

[philthehill]

There is an access hole just above the rack but it does not help as you cannot easily get to the inner ends of the bolts. Have a look at the access through the hole above the rack before you do anything.
If you do go through the inner wing aperture weld a piece of thin rod to the nut that way you can then hold the nut in place through the access hole. When the nut is tight cut off the excess rod. Instead of a spring washer you could use a self locking nut or Loctite to secure the nut.
Unfortunately it was a real pain to do but necessary. Thankfully I did manage to fit and secure the stripped bolt/thread.
Good luck
Phil

[jaekl]

At least the later vintage models where the outside air intake is through the cross member there are two inch diameter holes in the outer and inner skins of the cross member which allow difficult access to two bolts. The tapped plates are about 1/4 thick. You would need to get the angles right but a strip of metal with a tapped hole may be better than a nut since it won't be able to rotate much when in use. Of course when someone later removes the bolt they will hear a clunk and will need to gain access again, either from below or the side.

[philthehill]

With the early Minors fresh air did enter the car via the crossmember and into the passenger area via the kick plate. As you say there are two holes at the ends of the crossmember that allow for very restricted access to two of the damper mounting bolts but you would need to be a contortionist to do anything about stripped or damaged threads.
The later fresh air intake pipe goes through the bulkhead just under the bonnet release rod - not the crossmember.

[Andy999]

Had a similar rattle on mine for years - finally tracked down to wear between the splines on the torsion bar and arm. Even NOS arms were a "rattling good fit" on the torsion bar. Eventually found a good fit secondhand arm and it solved the problem

[myoldjalopy]

An update - found a bit of play in the offending side when front end off the ground and waggling the wheel from side to side. It is not swivel pins or trunnions. Spinning the wheel makes a rumbling noise, so wheel bearing on its way out - could that contribute to a knock/rattle? There is a sensation of that wheel wobbling a bit over severe bumps.
A little bit of play in the rear shock absorber link arm on that side, but I can't see how that would cause a knock in the front. Could it??
As for the damper bolts, it is the off-side, not the near-side which only has three bolts tightened up, so that is opposite to the noisy side.
So, all I can think to do now is replace the wheel bearing and sort out the loose damper bolt and see what happens then.
Further thoughts welcome!