Amp + Speakers = Insurance Mod?

[egsj]

Hello. I've just had an amp (for my iPOd) fitted in the glovebox and speakers in the back of my Traveller (and am very happy with the results!). Am wondering if this counts as a 'modification' and therefore needs to be declared to my insurers. I know I could pose this question direct to them, but of course a query amounts to a declaration and I'm wondering if that would ramp up my premium - so I thought I'd canvass for opinions here first...

Anon

[moggyman64]

Hi Egsj

It depends on how much value you put on the equipement you have installed and are you prepared to possibly loose it, but I dont think they will charge that much to include it on your policy. I added a Pioneer stereo with 10 CD changer and the cost was so small I cant even remember what it was.

regards

Keith

[theminorsite]

Given the way FJ have started to reclassify Minors I'd be surprised if putting this years tax disc in the window didn't count as a modification! I'm really not sure what's happening over there recently - a car very locally to me was refused a quote a month ago because it had a Midget gearbox, and Rosie told me about someone who tried to justify the valuation of his car by saying he'd replaced the front wings and was told it was now a modified car!

[aupickup]

well its my last year with FJ
I had been with them for years and now I have only the one morris car my insurance doubled as it was my only car

[theminorsite]

What concerns me most is at renewal time. If FJ are going to clamp down on modified cars as a fair amount of recent anecdotal evidence suggests, they'll likely not offer me a renewal even though they've insured it for the last four years. And the way I understand it, that means that at every subsequent insurance quotation for this and any other cars, I wouldn't be able to say 'no, no, and no again' to the standard questions about accidents, claims, and have I ever been refused insurance!

[bpr81a]

So don't give them the chance to refuse. Try somewhere else first. I went to Peter James, and the whole thing was sorted out in less time than it usually takes FJ to answer the phone.

[chrisryder]

It's not just a case of 'declare the equipment if you want it covered'.

Having it fitted might void the rest of the policy, as it could make the whole vehicle more attractive to a would be thief.

It's potentially expensive to declare everything, but i'd rather pay £20 or something to ensure my policy pays out if the worst happens.

Ring FJ and tell them you're THINKING of fitting the equipment, and ask if it would make a difference. IF they say it's fine, be sure to take their name, and make a note of who/when/what from your phonecall. That way, if there is a claim, and they try not to pay out because of undisclosed modifications then you have evidence to show that you were told it wasn't a problem.

[egsj]

Many thanks,, Keith. That's useful advice. Like most on this thread, I'm with Footman James and becoming increasingly wary about the costs and level of service...

[jagnut66]

Hi,
I've never declared any stereos or speakers that I've fitted into any car I have owned, for one thing I didn't think I needed to.
If it gets nicked I'll just replace it. I would be more concerned about the damage a thief might do to get to it. Which is why mine is out of sight..............
But to call a stereo a modification is plain daft / OTT!
Best wishes,
Mike.

[irmscher]

Well said Keith its about time the big boys stopped having the monopoly and most hide under a club banner. Shop around its worth it and don't give money away

[Dave@FJ]

Hello. I've just had an amp (for my iPOd) fitted in the glovebox and speakers in the back of my Traveller (and am very happy with the results!). Am wondering if this counts as a 'modification' and therefore needs to be declared to my insurers. I know I could pose this question direct to them, but of course a query amounts to a declaration and I'm wondering if that would ramp up my premium - so I thought I'd canvass for opinions here first...

Anon

IF you're insured with Footman James audio equipment permanently fitted in your vehicle is insured against loss or damage but we will only pay the market value of the equipment at the time of the loss or damage. We will pay up to £750 for audio which is not fitted as standard.

You WILL need to notify us of the equipment that has been installed but there will be no additional premium charged if the value is less than £750

Best regards

Dave

[Dave@FJ]

Given the way FJ have started to reclassify Minors I'd be surprised if putting this years tax disc in the window didn't count as a modification! I'm really not sure what's happening over there recently - a car very locally to me was refused a quote a month ago because it had a Midget gearbox, and Rosie told me about someone who tried to justify the valuation of his car by saying he'd replaced the front wings and was told it was now a modified car!

Mike, i'm quite surprised that you've posted this as we have discussed it on a number of occasions.

You're more than aware that this particular vehicle had substantial modifications, not just the midget gearbox. It WAS intitially refused a quote on the basis of modifications but following my conversation with our underwriters was subsequently accepted. The gentleman in question was absolutely delighted with his premium.

I've done alot of work with our insurers over the past month regarding modifications and many of the mods that were unacceptable a month or so ago have now been approved. It's an ongoing project so, if anyone does have any issues with this please contact me directly and i'll be more than happy to look at cases individually. Cant' say fairer than that surely?

[theminorsite]

Hi Dave
Thanks for the clarification. Are you able to give a definitive answer on whether FJ are changing their emphasis and now no longer want to deal with modified Minors? Personally I'm less concerned with what constitutes a modified car as I'm certainly in that camp no matter how its classified, but I recognise others here with mods such as a 1275 lump or a 5-speed box will also be concerned.

If FJ want to steer away from that market then that's fine, but as explained earlier in the thread then I'd really rather know before renewal time rather than at it, especially if that refusal then itself becomes declarable to future insurers. I don't profess to know how that market works, but I'd be more than a bit miffed if, for example, I found later that XYZinsurance limited refused to quote me purely because I'd already been refused insurance elsewhere!

Apologies to the OP for changing the emphasis of his thread but I think its certainly a related question.

[theminorsite]

Given the way FJ have started to reclassify Minors I'd be surprised if putting this years tax disc in the window didn't count as a modification! I'm really not sure what's happening over there recently - a car very locally to me was refused a quote a month ago because it had a Midget gearbox, and Rosie told me about someone who tried to justify the valuation of his car by saying he'd replaced the front wings and was told it was now a modified car!

Mike, i'm quite surprised that you've posted this as we have discussed it on a number of occasions.

You're more than aware that this particular vehicle had substantial modifications, not just the midget gearbox. It WAS intitially refused a quote on the basis of modifications but following my conversation with our underwriters was subsequently accepted. The gentleman in question was absolutely delighted with his premium.

I've done alot of work with our insurers over the past month regarding modifications and many of the mods that were unacceptable a month or so ago have now been approved. It's an ongoing project so, if anyone does have any issues with this please contact me directly and i'll be more than happy to look at cases individually. Cant' say fairer than that surely?

Sorry Dave, our posts crossed over - I didn't see yours until I'd posted my last (I thought the forum automatically informed you when that happened, but hey ho!

He was most certainly happy with his premium, yes. My point wasn't that he couldn't get insurance, but more a general concern that we had to raise the issue with you personally before he could get a quote. What if we didn't know you to ask you to reconsider it? I also know now of other people who've had letters at their renewal time saying that FJ isn't going to quote for the business, which in the absence of knowledge that there is an 'appeal route' via yourself has meant they have gone elsewhere.

[Dave@FJ]

Hi Dave
Thanks for the clarification. Are you able to give a definitive answer on whether FJ are changing their emphasis and now no longer want to deal with modified Minors? Personally I'm less concerned with what constitutes a modified car as I'm certainly in that camp no matter how its classified, but I recognise others here with mods such as a 1275 lump or a 5-speed box will also be concerned.

If FJ want to steer away from that market then that's fine, but as explained earlier in the thread then I'd really rather know before renewal time rather than at it, especially if that refusal then itself becomes declarable to future insurers. I don't profess to know how that market works, but I'd be more than a bit miffed if, for example, I found later that XYZinsurance limited refused to quote me purely because I'd already been refused insurance elsewhere!

Apologies to the OP for changing the emphasis of his thread but I think its certainly a related question.

Couple of points in there that need clarifying....

Firstly, categorically NO.....FJ are not wanting to steer away from modified Minors. As with all brokers, from time to time our insurers will change the criteria of vehicles which they are willing to insure. Bearing in mind that we offer cover for a multitude of different vehicles modifications are a complicated issue for them. I've been working closely with the insurers for the past few weeks and we're currently working to a mods guide that is acceptable. In many cases we have looked at the MMOC scheme with specific modifications acceptable to these vehicles only. As said in a previous post, this is a work in progress but I would say that 90% of the most common mods are included.

In terms of being refused cover....if you're looking for cover for a non-standard risk and your broker has changed their policy to now only cover standard risks then this can hardly be held against you in the future. This is true of any non-standard insurance need. As long as you disclose all of the relevant "material" facts (as you are required to do by the duty of "utmost good faith") and the insurer turns down your application before agreeing to give you cover, it will not be considered an insurance refusal.

[theminorsite]

Thank you Dave. That's very heartening news (on both points)

[Dave@FJ]

Given the way FJ have started to reclassify Minors I'd be surprised if putting this years tax disc in the window didn't count as a modification! I'm really not sure what's happening over there recently - a car very locally to me was refused a quote a month ago because it had a Midget gearbox, and Rosie told me about someone who tried to justify the valuation of his car by saying he'd replaced the front wings and was told it was now a modified car!

Mike, i'm quite surprised that you've posted this as we have discussed it on a number of occasions.

You're more than aware that this particular vehicle had substantial modifications, not just the midget gearbox. It WAS intitially refused a quote on the basis of modifications but following my conversation with our underwriters was subsequently accepted. The gentleman in question was absolutely delighted with his premium.

I've done alot of work with our insurers over the past month regarding modifications and many of the mods that were unacceptable a month or so ago have now been approved. It's an ongoing project so, if anyone does have any issues with this please contact me directly and i'll be more than happy to look at cases individually. Cant' say fairer than that surely?

Sorry Dave, our posts crossed over - I didn't see yours until I'd posted my last (I thought the forum automatically informed you when that happened, but hey ho!

He was most certainly happy with his premium, yes. My point wasn't that he couldn't get insurance, but more a general concern that we had to raise the issue with you personally before he could get a quote. What if we didn't know you to ask you to reconsider it? I also know now of other people who've had letters at their renewal time saying that FJ isn't going to quote for the business, which in the absence of knowledge that there is an 'appeal route' via yourself has meant they have gone elsewhere.

At the time of the quotation the modifications that had been made to the vehicle made it unacceptable to our insurers. From time to time their acceptance criteria WILL change and some risks will not be accepted. It was only because I was already working on an acceptable modifications project that I was able to intervene, ordinarily I would not have been able to do so.

A month later, things are much better. Our insurers have got a better understanding of common Morris Minor modifications and, between us, have agreed a long list of acceptance. It may not cover every possible mod but, in the main, it works.

Now stop beating me up about things things i've ;aready fixed

[irmscher]

I didn't realise other companies were notified if you had been refused insurance down to mods .I wondered do you have to declare this as they always ask

[Dave@FJ]

I didn't realise other companies were notified if you had been refused insurance down to mods .I wondered do you have to declare this as they always ask

See my post above, in these circumstances it doesn't count as a refusal

I don't believe that other companies are notified in circumstances where insurance is actually refused. As with many other questions it's a contract of 'good faith' and insurers rely on the proposer to disclose all the material facts

[irmscher]

Thanks for that