Warming up!

[mrs.smith2012]

Morning all,
I know the general advice for moggys is to not let them idle on the drive to warm up but to drive them gently at first.
The issue I have is that we live in a very busy town and as soon as we turn out of our street we hit a main road which is often busy and can be quite fast moving. It requires a quick pull out (with a hill start ) followed by lots of stops and starts as there are about a thousand mini roundabouts and crossings (the joys of urban living).
We took Nell out yesterday and she was initially very juddery and jumpy, particularly when pulling off. Now it could just be me not fully mastering my clutch control but I’m also wondering, considering the fast start, whether it would be advisable to allow her to warm up on the drive first before hitting the fast traffic.
Would appreciate some input from experienced owners, particularly if you also live in a busy area!
Thank you!

[mobylette]

I would be happy to let the engine warm up a little, certainly 5 mins would do no harm, make sure the choke is only out far enough for the engine to tick over, you may need to apply a little more choke when you first pull away.

[myoldjalopy]

It is not necessary to 'drive them gently at first'. Possibly either:

1.You are not using enough choke when driving off.
2.Your clutch control is in need of refining
3.There is something wrong with the clutch mechanism

I suspect the first issue, and you will have to experiment - how much choke required to start, how far to push back in slightly, when to push back in fully. Clearly, you will need more choke (fuel enrichment) in winter than in summer.
Mobylette may be 'happy' to let the engine warm up on the drive, but it really is not necessary.

[ManyMinors]

I agree. I have never needed to let my Minors "warm up" before setting off and they are happy to be driven straight off. In cold winter weather, quite a bit of choke may be required though for the first half a mile or even more. This will depend on how the carburettor is set up and you'll have to experiment with the choke and tick-over speed as well as the clutch - which again can be adjusted easily to suit you. You'll master it. Early days yet. Just keep practicing. Maybe on an empty Industrial estate at a weekend or something?

[mike1864]

And if you DO decide to let it (or ANY car) warm up on the drive, don't leave it unattended .

[Mervin]

With reference to myoldjallopy's point no. "2".
From one of Mrssmith's posts. "Nell’s clutch is very high and I find it difficult to move off smoothly without either stalling or bunny hopping"
Without knowing the clutch operating mechanism, as posted 1275cc engine and van gearbox, that could be an adjustment issue and the cause of the juddery take offs. Does it still have the mechanical linkage or has there been a conversion to an hydraulic or cable opeated clutch? It appears there have been a few modifications to the car. The bite point on my car is at about half of pedal travel and about 1" free play.
I'm in the camp of drive it almost immediately, possibly allow a few seconds at idle to allow for full oil circulation, particularly in colder temperatures.
Is the choke (fuel enrichment) remaining fully out? Or is the choke (fuel enrichment) being reduced too soon?

[KeithL]

I'm not sure if that has been covered already but is the choke actually doing anything at the other end or does it need adjusting or tightening up? Might be worth get someone to watch the carburettor end whilst you slowly move the choke out and in.

[mrs.smith2012]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I think the choke is fine as when I do adjust it I do hear and feel a clear difference in the engine… so it’s doing something! I will heed your advice and double check this though.

I’m not sure about all the technical aspects of the gearbox. I did plan for my friend to have a look with me yesterday but the rain wrote that idea off! When it dries out a little I’ll get the clutch checked.

My clutch control is improving I think but still room for improvement! From what you guys have said, my issues likely stem from me not mastering my clutch control and choke… so I’ll work on that. I will of course get my friend to help me check her over though. Admittedly Nell’s owner took me out on two test drives, from a cold start and she was perfect so I think it’s me!

I think I just wanted to clarify that I definitely shouldn’t be warming her up before moving and going into fast traffic

[myoldjalopy]

Consider this - the Operation Manual/Driver's Handbook states: " It is extremely bad practice to allow the engine to warm up from cold by letting it idle slowly."
Also, this - the Morris Minor would not have sold in such great numbers if every time anyone wanted to go for a drive, they had to leave it stationary and wait around until it was warmed up enough to drive away! The whole point of the choke is to allow the driver to start the engine from cold and drive off straight away.
You will soon get the hang of the choke with a bit of experimentation and practice. The same applies to your use of the clutch, assuming it is working correctly.

[svenedin]

As others have said, it takes a while to master the use of the choke. All engines are slightly different so you need to listen to the engine and adjust the choke according to how the engine behaves. This applies to my own car (1098cc) and it may not suit all. If my engine is absolutely cold, I pull the choke out as far as it will go. I then start the engine. After just a few seconds running and before I back out of the garage, I reduce the choke considerably. I do this because I can hear the engine is running too rich. It is running rough and I reduce the choke until I get an even fast idle. Then I drive off. After maybe 1/4 mile (depends how cold the weather is) I push the choke in all the way. If doing this makes the engine sound hesitant I pull the choke out a little bit and drive further before pushing the choke all the way in. So the engine can run badly during warm up from either too much or too little choke. Too little manifests as an engine that feels powerless and hesitant and easily stalls.

Stephen

[ndevans]

The best way to warm your engine (and your car) up is to drive it. No need to go gently, but there's possibly no harm in not going racing off at high speed straight off the drive (which sounds like it would be tricky anyway).
I agree that the clutch needs checking; as stated elsewhere, there should be some free play at the pedal. If the linkage is worn between the pedal and the release fork then maybe free play had been taken up at the expense of moving the biting point higher up in the pedal travel. It sounds like it's worth getting someone familiar with Minors, or at least classics, to check it out.

[mrs.smith2012]

Thanks all, my usual method is to pull the choke fully out to start (she won’t start otherwise) then once she fires up I normally push it about half in… then I’ll move off. Depending on how long I’m driving for I’ll inch the choke in as I go.

I believe the gearbox is still mechanical, it hasn’t been converted. I did test the clutch with my hand while she was on the drive earlier and there is a fair bit of play in it… although hard to give the exact measurement… might try and test it with a ruler tomorrow.

I would describe the clutch as quite ‘stiff’ but I’m comparing it to the modern manual I took a few lessons in recently… so I know it’s not going to feel like that! I think I just need to get more practiced (although I will check the clutch when weather allows). I appreciate the comments. I just wanted to confirm I was definitely doing the right thing driving her straight off.

Just thinking back to my old 95 fiesta and you had to let that warm up on the drive before you moved or it would just conk out on you halfway up the road

I realise that moggys are a bit different! Plus that old fiesta was shot to bits

[svenedin]

Your old Fiesta probably had an automatic choke that wasn't working! In the Morris you are in control.

Stephen

[ndevans]

Sounds about right, I have my choke out about 3/4 of the full travel, then push it in over the first ½ mile or so, depending on how cold it is.
You'll know if it has had a hydraulic clutch lift kit installed, there will be a fluid reservoir under the bonnet (possibly two if a remote brake reservoir has been installed)

[mrs.smith2012]

Your old Fiesta probably had an automatic choke that wasn't working! In the Morris you are in control.

Stephen

It was a manual choke which I had to pull in and out… but it was an automatic transmission so I don’t know if that made any difference… plus I bought the car for 100 quid off eBay… soooo

[mrs.smith2012]

Sounds about right, I have my choke out about 3/4 of the full travel, then push it in over the first ½ mile or so, depending on how cold it is.
You'll know if it has had a hydraulic clutch lift kit installed, there will be a fluid reservoir under the bonnet (possibly two if a remote brake reservoir has been installed)

I’m quite certain there is nothing like that so I think it is still the mechanical clutch, weather permitting I’ll take her out over the next day or so and just practice! After a bit of a hair-raising drive on Tuesday I have no plans to take her out in the rain until I’m more confident with handling

[mike1864]

Sounds about right, I have my choke out about 3/4 of the full travel, then push it in over the first ½ mile or so, depending on how cold it is.
You'll know if it has had a hydraulic clutch lift kit installed, there will be a fluid reservoir under the bonnet (possibly two if a remote brake reservoir has been installed)

As mentioned upthread, an under-bonnet photo would really help the forum members give advice on this - and any other - issues.

[mrs.smith2012]

Sounds about right, I have my choke out about 3/4 of the full travel, then push it in over the first ½ mile or so, depending on how cold it is.
You'll know if it has had a hydraulic clutch lift kit installed, there will be a fluid reservoir under the bonnet (possibly two if a remote brake reservoir has been installed)

As mentioned upthread, an under-bonnet photo would really help the forum members give advice on this - and any other - issues.

It would, thank you for the reminder! I haven’t managed to get her out today as it’s rained non stop, but weather permitting tomorrow I will try and get some under bonnet shots as well as some of the dash, because she has some extra buttons