1275 installation clutch release

[JeremyS556]

My Traveller has a 1275cc engine which was installed prior to my buying the car.
Since then I have gradually been ‘losing’ clutch pedal travel, resulting in the clutch engaging closer and closer to the floor. I have adjusted what appears to be the standard release linkage rod twice over a period to obtain the correct pedal free play and now have run out of adjustment!
As the linkage appears to be in reasonable condition am I right in thinking the issue must be the carbon release bearing worn out?
I ask your opinion as I assume the engine has a diaphragm clutch and therefore may it have a roller release bearing, which I can’t find listed other than for use with a hydraulic release conversion…….?
I would rather just order a standard carbon bearing but am slightly uneasy about whether the issue has arisen because of the original installation not being correct?
The other option which I can ill afford is to convert the whole lot to hydraulic operation….?!
Am I missing something and should I also renew the clutch release fork?

[philthehill]

Before giving a qualified answer.
What 1275cc engine have you got fitted?
What gearbox have you got fitted?
Once the above questions are addressed suitable answers to your questions can be given.

[JeremyS556]

Hi Phil and thank you for your reply..I’m embarrassed to say that the only identification I have discovered for the engine, because the little aluminium engine number plate had been removed before I bought the car, is the number 12G940 cast into the cylinder head. The gearbox appears to be a Sprite/Midget one and I only know this because the mountings I bought from ESM were wrong and I ended up with the Sprite/Midget ones which are fine. The engine has twin HS2 SU carburettors and a three branch fabricated exhaust manifold.
Is that enough for you to advise me or I could take photos….?
Regards,
Jeremy

[mowogg]

Have you checked the clutch relay shaft bearings? The bearings fail in then ends and you slowly loose the clutch as thr pivot point drifts forwards.

[philthehill]

The two identifiers of a 1275cc engine is the position of the oil filter and whether the cam followers are encased in the block or there are cam follower access chest covers.
The Marina/Ital engine has the oil filter just above and to the left of the distributer. The 1275cc Midget engine has the oil filter in the same position as the Minor 1000.
The Marina/Ital and 1275cc Midget has no access to the cam followers as the cam followers are encased in the block.
The 1275cc Cooper S has cam follower access covers.
Photos of the N/S and O/S of the engine would be appreciated.

[Atulm]

Since you have adjusted the linkage rod for two times it seems that the problem is with the worn carbon release bearing...

[philthehill]

Atulm
You may be right in your diagnosis but the OP has asked for an opinion on what clutch parts are fitted to his car.
There are several different types of carbon thrusts fitted the 'A' Series engine/gearbox so until the engine and gearbox have been positively identified a qualified answer cannot be given.

[JeremyS556]

Thank you all for your thoughts which are very much appreciated.

Phil, I have taken photos of both sides of the engine and have asked the ‘Administrator’ if / how I get them attached to a reply. The oil filter is below the alternator and there are no camshaft access covers in the other side, just “1275” plate at the front top end of the block.
I’ll be straight back assuming I am allowed to attach my pictures.

[philthehill]

From what you have said above the engine appears to be a 1275cc Midget/Sprite item.
Below is a useful link which identifies the various clutch release arms and carbon thrusts.
https://gerardsgarage.com/Garage/Tech/T ... arings.htm
From the above you should be able to identify what you require as regards carbon thrusts and release arms.
The Midget clutch operation using the Minor linkage is quite heavy.
Modifying the relay arm as shown in the drawing below makes the clutch operation more pleasurable.

Modified relay lever (1).jpg (74.42 KiB) Viewed 704 times

Here is a link to the MOSS web site for 1275cc clutch assys:-
https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/shop-by-m ... 67-79.html
The release bearing required is Pt No: GRB 107 (MOSS).

[JeremyS556]

Hi Phil,
Wow! That’s just superb and thank you so much!
I just have to wait now for my technical ‘boss’ to make the time available for us to start the surgery and get the various new parts on order……
With your help we will be able thoroughly relish the job and ensure a ‘proper job’ is the outcome.
Best wishes,
Jeremy
…..and thanks again to the others who have offered their thoughts and advice

[philthehill]

Thank you for the photos
To confirm - you have a 1275cc MG Midget/Sprite engine.
I am confident that the gearbox is also 1275cc MG Midget/Sprite.
When you take out the engine - examine the gearbox first motion shaft for the stamped number. The stamped number will confirm which gearbox is fitted. The stamped number for a 1275cc gearbox should be 22G229.
The 1275cc MG Midget/Sprite clutch is a diaphragm unit with a carbon release bearing - see Moss parts link for further details.

[JeremyS556]

Once again Phil thank you very much indeed for your time and comprehensive advice.
If you weren’t clearly so busy I’d be back in touch with the outcome of my case, but I am absolutely confident you claim another happy correspondent!
Best wishes, Jeremy

[JeremyS556]

Hi PhiltheHill! - ref my previous post:

Attached are photos of either side of the release fork / bearing as removed today…and I am delighted that with your advice we waded in and were proved right about the reason I ‘lost’ clutch pedal travel….also there was a coil spring missing from the pedal linkage assembly so could this be why the bearing wore away in the first place.

download/file.php?mode=view&id=25164
download/file.php?mode=view&id=25163

As you will see the bearing and fork were virtually heat welded together and the bearing was in several bits in the bottom of the bell housing…!?

The release fork has 22G169 ( not 168 ) clearly embossed near the pivot bush but the bearing only has ARP 2026 cast on the reverse face…..It looks identical to the one ESM Minors are showing for the 1098cc application, so unless you advise against I plan to order that one….

Best regards
Jeremy

[philthehill]

Before you order anything I would confirm what gearbox you have in the car.
As I suggested above check the number stamped on the first motion shaft and if you post that number on here we can confirm the gearbox fitted.
A photo of your clutch cover as fitted would be helpful.
The 12G169 release arm is correct. For some reason only known to them BMC decided to put the casting number and part number 1 digit apart on the majority of cast parts. I have checked the casting and part number against the spare 1275cc clutch release arm I have.
The missing spring would not of helped in keeping the carbon thrust away from the thrust pad of the clutch cover.

[JeremyS556]

Phil,

Having a nightmare ‘dragging and dropping’ photos into the message box, so hopefully as they are showing for me below, they are accessible to you…?

In summary it seems I should go ahead and get the 22G168 fork and the GRB107 bearing (as you advise), however from my previous photo it would seem that the old bearing, by it’s ‘depth’ is a GRB102….?

The first motion shaft, from the excellent gerrardsgarage website, is clearly the longer of the two possible and therefore correct for the 22G118 input housing which is clearly stamped.
Am I about right and ready to order?

Thank you Phil.
Regards,
Jeremy

[philthehill]

You have the 1275cc Midget clutch assy fitted.
You also have the correct MG Midget clutch release arm which is used with the hydraulic release system.
I am not sure how you have attached the mechanical linkage to the hydraulic lever but it appears to work. A photo of the linkage when assembled/attached linkage would be appreciated
You need the deep release bearing to go with the above.
https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/release-b ... soc=405666
To help the pedal pressure I would lengthen the relay shaft inner lever (the straighter of the two) by 5/8". This is a well known modification.

Modified relay lever.jpg (74.29 KiB) Viewed 36 times

Also replace the chassis rubber bush for the relay shaft with a poly bush.