Performance upgrades
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- Minor Fan
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Performance upgrades
From reading several posts I’ve decided to upgrade my standard 1098 traveller. I just want a bit more power when pulling out of junctions, going up hills and for 60mph not to be such a struggle. So I’m planning to add:
HIF38 carb
Alloy inlet
Large bore l.c.b. exhaust
BUT, I really don’t want to change the character of the exhaust. I just love that Moggy sound!!
Can anybody tell me please whether the classic burble and that oh-so-lovely exhaust “fart”, will remain?
Also, will it help crankcase pressure and improve/resolve what I think is a rear scroll oil leak? (Note that this drips overnight, not just when running, so could be something else)
HIF38 carb
Alloy inlet
Large bore l.c.b. exhaust
BUT, I really don’t want to change the character of the exhaust. I just love that Moggy sound!!
Can anybody tell me please whether the classic burble and that oh-so-lovely exhaust “fart”, will remain?
Also, will it help crankcase pressure and improve/resolve what I think is a rear scroll oil leak? (Note that this drips overnight, not just when running, so could be something else)
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...
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- Minor Maniac
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Re: Performance upgrades
The Minor fart/burble will disappear when you fit the parts listed above.
Make sure that your existing breathing system is up to scratch and clear and there will be a good probability that the drip will disappear.
The performance up grades will in the main have no effect on the crankcase breathing capability's of your 1098cc engine but having the crankcase vented to the new carb will help reduce crankcase pressure (use search facility for details).
I would advise against fitting a rear scroll seal kit. The rear of the crankshaft is not designed or machined for the fitment of a lip seal. There are plenty of comment on here regarding the fitment of a lip seal (again use search facility).
Make sure that your existing breathing system is up to scratch and clear and there will be a good probability that the drip will disappear.
The performance up grades will in the main have no effect on the crankcase breathing capability's of your 1098cc engine but having the crankcase vented to the new carb will help reduce crankcase pressure (use search facility for details).
I would advise against fitting a rear scroll seal kit. The rear of the crankshaft is not designed or machined for the fitment of a lip seal. There are plenty of comment on here regarding the fitment of a lip seal (again use search facility).
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- Minor Fan
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Re: Performance upgrades
Thank you Phil. Yes, you and others have responded to my posts re leaks and I'm aware that only rebuilding a worn engine, if it is that, will resolve the rear leak, given that I've already implemented your breathing recommendations.
I got hold of an original rocker cover, refurbished it and fitted a pipe between that and the standard air filter. That resolved two other leaks I had, but not the one from the rear. I see that the pipe connection would move from the filter housing to the HIF38, post these mods.
I don't want to lose that classic sound though so I'm going to have to re-think this. Seems like cutting off the intake part of the standard manifold, to add the HIF38 & alloy intake, might be my only options to add power. From what I've read, there's no point in going the 12G940 route unless I'm also going to fit an improved exhaust, which brings me back full circle to not wanting to lose the classic sound. I would pay for that sound alone, so there's no way I'm losing that!
I got hold of an original rocker cover, refurbished it and fitted a pipe between that and the standard air filter. That resolved two other leaks I had, but not the one from the rear. I see that the pipe connection would move from the filter housing to the HIF38, post these mods.
I don't want to lose that classic sound though so I'm going to have to re-think this. Seems like cutting off the intake part of the standard manifold, to add the HIF38 & alloy intake, might be my only options to add power. From what I've read, there's no point in going the 12G940 route unless I'm also going to fit an improved exhaust, which brings me back full circle to not wanting to lose the classic sound. I would pay for that sound alone, so there's no way I'm losing that!
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...
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- Minor Legend
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Re: Performance upgrades
60mph a struggle? A good 1098 cc should not 'struggle' at 60. Are you sure the brakes aren't binding? Are points, spark plug and valve gaps correct?
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- Minor Fan
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Re: Performance upgrades
Maybe I’m being unfair when I say that. She’ll do 60, and actually has some poke left, but just takes ages getting there. It’s more the acceleration from junctions, roundabouts etc, and going up hills, that I’d like to improve.
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...
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- Minor Legend
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Re: Performance upgrades
Fit a nitro kit.
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- Minor Fan
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Re: Performance upgrades
Or I could just eat more beans for breakfast, do the mods and still retain that fart sound, yes?!
I just want a small gain in power, not to race the local scoobies on a Friday night.
I’m thinking I’ll cut the inlet part off of the standard manifold and fit the metro inlet with a HIF38. A shame, as I’d love to lose that stupid manifold to downpipe join, but never mind. From others’ posts that would bring some useful gains but I’ll retain the classic Moggy sound. No, not the miaow, the exhaust note…
I just want a small gain in power, not to race the local scoobies on a Friday night.
I’m thinking I’ll cut the inlet part off of the standard manifold and fit the metro inlet with a HIF38. A shame, as I’d love to lose that stupid manifold to downpipe join, but never mind. From others’ posts that would bring some useful gains but I’ll retain the classic Moggy sound. No, not the miaow, the exhaust note…
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...
Re: Performance upgrades
I've got to say Ted the traveller has regained his parp I previously made a few mods namely a HS4 on an alloy inlet manifold, 12G940 head off a 1275 Mini and a Midget exhaust manifold into an 1 1/2" 'sports' exhaust. All this robbed him of his trumpeting Since then I've smoothed out the bend from the manifold to down pipe and, although not quite the same, the sound on the overrun is very pleasing - more of a base trombone than a trumpet but music to my ears
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- Minor Fan
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Re: Performance upgrades
I’d have to hear yours to be convinced. I just love the noise on the down-change, and also the overrun of course. Makes me laugh in a way that only my old MR2 used to!
Glad Ted has his parp back though; he must be much happier too!!
Glad Ted has his parp back though; he must be much happier too!!
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...
Re: Performance upgrades
Yes,exhaust parp is a nice little quirk of the Minor, no doubt caused by a rather restrictive silencer box placed much further forward than is usually the case. So I don't think parp and performance will really go together....PhilipW1039 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:35 am From reading several posts I’ve decided to upgrade my standard 1098 traveller. I just want a bit more power when pulling out of junctions, going up hills and for 60mph not to be such a struggle. So I’m planning to add:
HIF38 carb
Alloy inlet
Large bore l.c.b. exhaust
BUT, I really don’t want to change the character of the exhaust. I just love that Moggy sound!!
Can anybody tell me please whether the classic burble and that oh-so-lovely exhaust “fart”, will remain?
Also, will it help crankcase pressure and improve/resolve what I think is a rear scroll oil leak? (Note that this drips overnight, not just when running, so could be something else)
I am wondering whether you find 60mph simply too busy (too many revs) for distance cruising, as I did, which is why I fitted the 3.9 diff. You would expect that acceleration would suffer but I can't really say I've noticed it. As for pepping the engine up a bit without having to go the 12g940 head /bigger carb/different manifold/big bore exhaust route I have been wondering about this
myself and struggling to come up with an answer. I did wonder whether simply skimming about 50 thou off the standard head and changing the silencer for one less restrictive would be worth doing. Of course the parp would go, probably...
Anyone tried such a mod? Of course Vizard doesn't talk about this so I'm kind of assuming that the gains would be minimal.
Re: Performance upgrades
A quick parpPhilipW1039 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 1:01 pm I’d have to hear yours to be convinced. I just love the noise on the down-change, and also the overrun of course. Makes me laugh in a way that only my old MR2 used to!
Glad Ted has his parp back though; he must be much happier too!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QJh2ZMHqqc
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- Minor Fan
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Re: Performance upgrades
Pardon you!
Cyrus, you’re absolutely right re the 60 mph - it just feels like I’m running at 9000 rpm.
No idea on your performance idea but I’m going to try just the carb. BMC reckoned an extra 5bhp from that, plus generally smoother running, which would suit me. An improved air filter might help too. The Moggy often feels like quite a rough engine I think.
Cyrus, you’re absolutely right re the 60 mph - it just feels like I’m running at 9000 rpm.
No idea on your performance idea but I’m going to try just the carb. BMC reckoned an extra 5bhp from that, plus generally smoother running, which would suit me. An improved air filter might help too. The Moggy often feels like quite a rough engine I think.
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...
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- Minor Maniac
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Re: Performance upgrades
Compared to the 948cc A series the 1098cc A series engine is rough.
A good mod is to fit a crankshaft damper - make the engine much smoother. Can be obtained new or S/H. If going the S/H route make sure the rubber between the two parts of the damper is sound. Can be used with the starter dog as well.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/304490924619 ... BMrO6Vvcdg
The damper timing ring would have to be removed from the damper in the link above but that is an easy job and has no downside
problems.
http://www.minispares.com/product/Class ... o%20search
A good mod is to fit a crankshaft damper - make the engine much smoother. Can be obtained new or S/H. If going the S/H route make sure the rubber between the two parts of the damper is sound. Can be used with the starter dog as well.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/304490924619 ... BMrO6Vvcdg
The damper timing ring would have to be removed from the damper in the link above but that is an easy job and has no downside
problems.
http://www.minispares.com/product/Class ... o%20search
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- Minor Fan
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Re: Performance upgrades
You know I’ve never even heard of this part, thank you Mr TheHill. I’ll look into this.
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...
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- Minor Maniac
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Re: Performance upgrades
Here is the Cooper 'S' Version fitted to my engine . Does the same job as the one in the link of my previous post. Would not run an engine without one.
Re: Performance upgrades
Thought I would add my experiences with an HS4 on an ally inlet and cut down exhaust manifold. My first mistake was connecting the air connection on the (engine side) of the carb to the rocker cover connection, see diagram, as has been recommended on this very forum . This resulted in a weak mixture, worse at lower engine speeds, that was impossible to correct . The car would not run smoothly or without full choke until fully warmed up ,even with the heater pipes connected through the heated inlet manifold. I eventually blanked this air pipe off on the carb, and fitted a pipe to the air filter to copy the original set up. A great improvement. Next, as the carb was from a different vehicle (MGB I think) , the float chamber angle was out of vertical by 10° . I had thought this small difference would have little effect, but I bought and fitted the correct float chamber adaptor from Burlen (https://sucarb.co.uk/float-chambers-spa ... ptors.html), and warm up & performance are again improved and I am happy that the set up is as good as it can be. Hope this may save you some grief.PhilipW1039 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:14 pm Pardon you!
Cyrus, you’re absolutely right re the 60 mph - it just feels like I’m running at 9000 rpm.
No idea on your performance idea but I’m going to try just the carb. BMC reckoned an extra 5bhp from that, plus generally smoother running, which would suit me. An improved air filter might help too. The Moggy often feels like quite a rough engine I think.
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Last edited by mobylette on Wed Jul 27, 2022 3:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- geoberni
- Minor Legend
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Re: Performance upgrades
Philphilthehill wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:43 pm Compared to the 948cc A series the 1098cc A series engine is rough.
A good mod is to fit a crankshaft damper - make the engine much smoother. Can be obtained new or S/H. If going the S/H route make sure the rubber between the two parts of the damper is sound. Can be used with the starter dog as well.
Presumably this pulley wouldn't have the timing notch on it for Minor application, so a careful filing of the edge would be required if wishing to strobe light using the original pointer on the engine?
Berni
Basil the 1955 series II
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- Minor Maniac
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Re: Performance upgrades
You have to make your own mark with the damper pulley.
As you can see above I have painted a mark on the timing cover and a correctly positioned mark on the pulley. Much easier than scrabbling below the car. Declan Burns does a very nice timing mark indicator that can be viewed from above (use search facility for details).
If you want the Minor mark position - time the engine, remove the Minor pulley, fit the damper pulley, mark the damper pulley against the Minor timing marks and all is well to go.
The three rivets holding the timing disc to the back of the damper pulley I have drilled out and tapped the holes. I can now use my harmonic damper puller to remove the damper from the crankshaft. I use the later crankshaft bolt with dimple between the puller and the crankshaft nose to save damaging the crankshaft/crankshaft threads.
As you can see above I have painted a mark on the timing cover and a correctly positioned mark on the pulley. Much easier than scrabbling below the car. Declan Burns does a very nice timing mark indicator that can be viewed from above (use search facility for details).
If you want the Minor mark position - time the engine, remove the Minor pulley, fit the damper pulley, mark the damper pulley against the Minor timing marks and all is well to go.
The three rivets holding the timing disc to the back of the damper pulley I have drilled out and tapped the holes. I can now use my harmonic damper puller to remove the damper from the crankshaft. I use the later crankshaft bolt with dimple between the puller and the crankshaft nose to save damaging the crankshaft/crankshaft threads.
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- Minor Fan
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Re: Performance upgrades
Thanks ever so much for posting that. I wouldn’t have had a clue how to correct that! Which is fine as it would have ended up in a local garage to sort out but much better to avoid it in the first place. Two really useful points, thank you.mobylette wrote: ↑Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:41 pmThought I would add my experiences with an HS4 on an ally inlet and cut down exhaust manifold. My first mistake was connecting the air connection on the (engine side) of the carb to the rocker cover connection, see diagram, as has been recommended on this very forum . This resulted in a weak mixture, worse at lower engine speeds, that was impossible to correct . The car would not run smoothly or without full choke until fully warmed up ,even with the heater pipes connected through the heated inlet manifold. I eventually blanked this air pipe off on the carb, and fitted a pipe to the air filter to copy the original set up. A great improvement. Next, as the carb was from a different vehicle (MGB I think) , the float chamber angle was out of vertical by 10° . I had thought this small difference would have little effect, but I bought and fitted the correct float chamber adaptor from Burlen (https://sucarb.co.uk/float-chambers-spa ... ptors.html), and warm up & performance are again improved and I am happy that the set up is as good as it can be. Hope this may save you some grief.PhilipW1039 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:14 pm Pardon you!
Cyrus, you’re absolutely right re the 60 mph - it just feels like I’m running at 9000 rpm.
No idea on your performance idea but I’m going to try just the carb. BMC reckoned an extra 5bhp from that, plus generally smoother running, which would suit me. An improved air filter might help too. The Moggy often feels like quite a rough engine I think.
Philip
Just gradually working things out...
Just gradually working things out...