2 door VAE 306H

Let us all know what you are up to with your current restoration project. Get that Minor on the road!
Forum rules
By using this site, you agree to our rules. Please see: Terms of Use
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

Car is going fine, fan seems to work better now we have bled all the air out (had to add a further 1.5 litres of coolant).

Andrew has now bought this he wants to tow behind it for camping etc.
rps20210810_210219.jpg
rps20210810_210219.jpg (193.43 KiB) Viewed 45462 times
rps20210810_210205.jpg
rps20210810_210205.jpg (184.57 KiB) Viewed 45462 times
It's fundementaly sound, even the lights work OK.
We may replace the wheels with midget ones to match the car and he has loads of ash he felled and seasoned he will probably re-timber it with eventually.

First thing though is a tow bar for the minor (tried to insure him at 19 on the range rover they wanted 3 grand!) Most of the tow bars I have seen seem to hang off the bumper mounts and bolt to the floor just behind the fuel tank, none of which looks particularly clever. I was thinking of making something to bolt to the holed where the bumper moints to the body and goes under he fuel tank and bolts to tbe floor, anyone seen any better ideas?.
User avatar
geoberni
Minor Legend
Posts: 3565
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:19 am
Location: North Leicestershire
MMOC Member: Yes

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by geoberni »

I know there are some pretty strict rules and regulations about Tow Bars these days, not sure how they affect a car as old as a minor.
I think it only apples to cars made from the mid 90s.
Worth checking though....
Basil the 1955 series II

Image
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

They are supposed to carry a approval number after some point in tbe 90's which is the point manufacturers had to homologate the attachment points, it's a rig test where you bolt the bar to a bodyshell and apply loads via hydraulic actuators. I've witnessed it being done on a van with a 3.5T trailer, it's amazing how much things deflect!

But as you say none of this would ever have been done for a minor, it still seems to be a free for all with a variety of designs on sale some of which I would worry about putting a bike on!
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

Haven't done much about the tow bar, car seems to be going well, cooling fan works fine now all the air is bled out as well, gearbox still sounds awfull in first but seems to work OK though there is no discernable indent in first, is this normal?

One thing we do want to do is do something about the rear suspension, while the front feels sure footed and well planted the rear feels loose and bouncy. At the moment it is standard 5 leaf set up with the original untouched lever arm dampers.

We have some 7 leaf springs as well.

My thoughts are firstly to improve the damping, drain the probably 50 year old oil out and replace with 40 grade damper oil.

Secondly you can clearly feel it hitting the bump stops especially when loaded, they are new but seem a bit hard, maybe drill some holes in them or try to fit something more progressive off a modern like a ka any thoughts?

From my work on other cars and vans I know softer springs are often better for traction, do the 7 leaf ones affect this and the ride much?

I also thought about designing a dual rate leaf spring, something like 4 eliptical leaves with a rate similar to the 5 leaf and then a couple of virtually straight leaves which come into play as the suspension travels beyond the normal ride height, any idea if this has been done before on a minor? (I've seen it on plenty of other cars and vans)
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

It has been in regular use but has started making a unpleasant low frequency noise, we had all sorts of visions of something nasty until i leant on the alternator and the noise went away, turns out the back bolt is loose, an easy fix!
Otherwise nothing much seems to be leaking out and it's running fine, it will need an oil change and head re-torque soon and at the same time we will re fill the rear dampers as it hops and skips all over the place.
myoldjalopy
Minor Legend
Posts: 2518
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:32 pm
Location: Kernow
MMOC Member: Yes

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by myoldjalopy »

An easy fix indeed. We like them! 8)
ManyMinors
Minor Legend
Posts: 2752
Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 9:41 am
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by ManyMinors »

One thing I have noticed is that the new rear bump stops seem incredibly hard. Like blocks of oak with no give in them at all. These gave a horrible ride on my car when combined with no doubt, old rather worn springs. My short-term solution was to cut the top off them which improved the car no end :D .
We regularly used to tow a decent sized trailer behind our Minor. This often carried quite a load. The towbar was, as you suggest, fitted to the bumper mountings (which are quite strong) and bolted through the reinforced part of the boot floor where the spare wheel clamp is fitted. It was on our car for many years. I never had any problem with the towbar or mountings.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

I did wonder about the bump stops, they do seem very hard, I was thinking about something off a modern car, might try cutting the top off or drilling some holes in them.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

my son has been using it for a 20 mile each way commute most of the last couple of weeks, another problem yesterday, it was running rough, turned out one of the bolts holding the crank position sensor had come loose, tightened that up and all was well today, this may be because even though it has 10mm of clearance the alternator belt is has been touching the bracket (on the slack side).

I may have to splash out on a new alternator, the one on the car is the wrong hand but it was new and we had it so we cobbled some brackets to make it fit, I'm not very happy with it though, may see what alternatives there are out there that put out at least 50 Amps (it has heated seats and he want to fit heated screens too)
StillGotMy1stCar
Minor Fan
Posts: 433
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:37 pm
Location: Carmarthenshire
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by StillGotMy1stCar »

kevin s wrote: Thu Oct 28, 2021 10:13 pm I may have to splash out on a new alternator, the one on the car is the wrong hand but it was new and we had it so we cobbled some brackets to make it fit, I'm not very happy with it though, may see what alternatives there are out there that put out at least 50 Amps (it has heated seats and he want to fit heated screens too)
You can change the hand on some alternators by undoing the long bolts and rotating the front cover by 120° on Lucas units with three bolts, in your case I think it has four bolts so by 90°.
It does depend on the design of the front covers hanging and tensioning arrangement.

Regards John.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

Yes that's what I had intended to do but this one has 4 bolts so it doesn't work, I splashed out £60 on a 70 amp alternator of the correct hand last night, if he 's going to be doing a 150 miles a week in it through the winter it needs to be reliable. He's working 2 or 3 days a week for a builder he knows while studying for mechanical engineering degree so he won't be going to the same place forever.

The old one be may be a spare for the range rover or TR7V8, can't remember which hand they are at the moment though.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

Still waiting for all the alternator parts to arrive after over a month, the bracket finally arrived today (post office service is not fit for purpose around here) so it's just the fan belt we are waiting for now.

It hasn't been used much for the last couple of weeks because Andrew has exams next week, he went to use it today and the battery was flat (it's the old one out of my Lotus, he needs to invest in a new one). He dug the crank handle out and it started up straight away, compression is pretty good now though, he actually bent the crank handle!

He took it for a 30 mile run and all seems fine.

Jobs to do hopefully over xmas are fit the proper alternator and brackets, stop the fan belt hitting the crank sensor bracket, do something about the rear suspension (new oil in the dampers is the first thing) and make / fit a towbar.

Mind you I do have also a 35 year old Range rover to get through it's MOT in January as well.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

Car is still running fine, need to get it home for a service soon when we will fit the right alternator and possibly the LCB & twin su's we have for it.

On the other hand my so who's car it is has bought himself a maestro 1275 engine, We know it will need a custom flywheel, adaptor plate and pilot machining in the crank, given we will fit it with an mx5 or suzuki gearbox the adpator plate would be needed anyway, my son is a student studying mechanical engineering, designing and manufacturing this could become his final year project, handily they have all the equipment he would need to make it as well.


Edit

It appears with some very simple machining the mx5 flywheel bolts on the meastro crank, the flywheel also carries the pilot bearing, so might be simpler than we thought.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

For the first time since rebuilding the engine I actually drove it yesterday, went to the museum of power show with my son and wife. The new engine pulls like a train no need to change down for hills, smooth and a pleasure to drive, certainly feels strangled by the standard carb etc so cant wait to see what it's like on twin su's.

A oouple of small issues, my son has fitted the new alternator but wired the light connection to the tacho terminal, it's charging fine but the warnng light is dimly on, easy enough to fix. The centre led stop light has packed up, hopefully it will just be a connection in the boot. Other thing I noticed is a puff of smoke after an extended idle, it's not using any measureable amount of oil and is fine when driving, also has new valves guides and A+ type sesls but some must be gettong through, I'll check the sesls are all seated when I do the tappets but I'm not too worried about it.

Only thing which really detracted is the bouncy ride in the rear, need to change the damper oil next..

Other thing is a few chips to the bottom edge of the sills etc which are bleeding rust, we'll probably coat the bottom 1/4 inch in dynax ub as there is no sign of this in the areas under the car already done.
philthehill
Minor Maniac
Posts: 10767
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:05 pm
Location: Hampshire
MMOC Member: Yes

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by philthehill »

When you fitted the 'A' Plus seals did you use the valve guides with the 'A' Plus seal locating ring.
The 'A' Plus seals are not suitable for use with the plain non ringed valve guides.
The 'A' Plus seals should only be fitted to the inlet valves as the exhaust valves need all the lubrication they can get otherwise there is the possibility of the valve stems picking up in the guides as with unleaded fuel the exhaust valves will run hotter.
These are the correct valve guides for use with the 'A' Plus seals when used in a small block head:-
https://www.morrisminorspares.com/engin ... l-p1209547
For completeness this is the valve guide for use with the 'A' Plus seal when used in a large bore head:-
https://www.morrisminorspares.com/engin ... c-p1180438

kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

Yes it had the grooved guides (all 8)and the seals are only on the inlet valves (I'll check the last point in case I had a senior moment though!).

It's not a major worry it must only be a tiny amount of oil as the level hasn't changed in a couple of thousand miles it's not even leaking anywhere!
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

It's uni grant time so Andrew has been buying bits for his minor, this arrived today.
20220420_182438.jpg
20220420_182438.jpg (1.85 MiB) Viewed 43204 times
It's the bottom one a A+ 1275 head for the maestro engine, he paid £50 for it which seems reasonable, we have an A + rocker shaft, will buy new valves, guides and springs, looks like we can use 1098 head studs but I think we need new valve collets and possibly push rods.

It seems flat and crack free, has unleaded exhaust seats which look fine so will hopefully just need a 3 angle cut on the inlets mild porting and some new guides.

One thing I'm not sure about is the bypass, the head has the minor type one but the maestro waterpump doesnt, I was wondering if we could just use the heater with a taxi type bypass valve instead and improve the heater too.

He's also bought a towbar as well, so fitting that and changing the rear damper oil will be the next thing to do.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

A mx5 box is a tight squeeze I have done it but never got round to driving it. To make it fit you new back plate drilled to the mx5 bolt pattern, the bell housing cut to clear the steering rack and starter motor a concentric slave conversion, a custom made clutch plate, rear engine mounting and a propshaft, so not a simple task.
rps20210710_100333.jpg
rps20210710_100333.jpg (119 KiB) Viewed 43117 times
.

We have now gone a different direction though which is to couple it to a 1.3 maestro engine to which a mx5 flywheel and clutch bolts up with a minor modification.


Barratt Engineering (https://barrattengineering.co.uk/) do a 5 speed gearbox conversion for a 1275 midget based around a very compact Suzuki gearbox, I did ask him about a minor conversion and he is up for looking at it if there is demand (and ideally a car someone can lend him to develop it on)
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

Not sure what happened with the lastbpost it was meant as a reply to something completely different.

Anyway we now have a towbar fitted.
rps20220513_225420.jpg
rps20220513_225420.jpg (75.06 KiB) Viewed 42985 times
Seems to tow the little trailer fine, my son used it for a scout camp at the weekend with no problem and is off to Norfolk with a canoe on top of it this weekend.

I've also started looking at some uprated engine mounts, I have a pair of mk1 mx5 mounts in reasonable condition so those will be the donor.

This evening I made some adaptors to fit them to the engine front plate, it would be neater to modify the front plate to a single bolt fixing but I wanted to keep it a simple bolt on job.
rps20220524_214719.jpg
rps20220524_214719.jpg (110.89 KiB) Viewed 42985 times
rps20220524_215034.jpg
rps20220524_215034.jpg (86.08 KiB) Viewed 42985 times
Next up will be some new towers for the other side, I also want to make these so the mount can be moved 19mm further forward when we eventually fit the maestro engine.
kevin s
Minor Legend
Posts: 1376
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:20 pm
Location: Chelmsford, essex
MMOC Member: No

Re: 2 door VAE 306H

Post by kevin s »

I splashed out on a couple or repro mount towers to cut up.

Laying them on the front plate gives this:
tower sketch.jpg
tower sketch.jpg (552.22 KiB) Viewed 42912 times
the white line being roughly where it will be cut off and a new plate added, the orange roughly the new centre of the bolt, I'll try to make it so you can get a socket on the nut as well.

The holes in the new plate will also need to be slotted, we eventually plan to fit a modified Maestro 1275 engine which will sit 3/4" forward, swapping the towers side to side moves it forward 1 1/4" so they will need 1/4" movement each side.
towers.jpg
towers.jpg (670.05 KiB) Viewed 42912 times
Post Reply