Servo and Peddle box

[colindodds]

Probably a daft question But what servo and peddle box can I use without much fuss fitting in my Minor HELP Thanks

[bmcecosse]

Why do you need a servo?? It's only a small light car! They were driven by Little Old Ladies - and District Nurses! A servo doesn't make the brakes any 'better' -it just reduces pedal loading - which is low anyway IF the brakes are in GOOD CONDITION. The answer is - none - without much fuss........ I believe some use the assembly ex a Marina...if you can find one. But it does involve quite a bit of 'fuss'.

[colindodds]

When applying the breaks in this minor You need to book 2 weeks in advance to stop Disk brake conversion kit together with a servo is what I have in mind That way I can stop without a booking

[jagnut66]

You've started something now................

[les]

Looks like you need to overhaul the system before you add the servo and discs. Better than disguising the problem by those additions

[bmcecosse]

As above - all you need to do is to overhaul what you have ! Minor brakes will lock the wheels at 30 mph - easily - without excessive pressure - just look at any of the original road tests....the brakes actually fare well in the road tests - more especially the later 1098 cars with the larger 8" front drums. For any sane motoring they are perfectly adequate. Off with the drums and inspect the shoes and cylinders - and it's not expensive or difficult to fit all new parts. And even if you do decide to go for expensive discs - you still don't need a servo!

[simmitc]

This debate rages a lot from time to time. If you want a servo, then fit one. I drive Travellers with discs and servo to all brakes (another debate: all round or front only) and a saloon with standard drums and no servo. Both are fine and have their own advantages. To answer your original question, if you keep single circuit, then you can keep the existing layout almost "as is" but add a remote servo, no other changes needed (if you fit discs, then you do need to modify the M/C, but leave it where it is). If you want a dual circuit system then you will have to fit a pedal box and modify the bulkhead to fit.

Well maintained standard brakes will lock all four wheels, and no matter what you do, you can't get better braking than just before the rubber loses its grip; but, your car, your driving, your choice. Please, for everyone's sake, just make sure that whatever is fitted is done properly and works

[alexmcguffie]

The best thing I did to my brakes years ago was to replace the old worn drums with new. Made a fantastic difference. Better pedal feel, no judder and noticeably better stopping power etc.

I would only consider a servo for a driver who was more used to driving modern cars with little experience of classics. Jumping from a modern with a servo feel to the pedal to a classic with no servo could be seen as bit disconcerting.

There's a company called Spyder Cars who do a Zetec engine conversion for Lotus Elan+2's. They actually remove the original servo to give the driver better pedal feel with the same stopping power. Horses for courses

[bmcecosse]

Or - of course - search out a set of 9" Wolseley drums which are super light and super effective! Easy to fit, and don't cost a fortune........although the price does seem to have risen somewhat in recent years........

[blues2rock]

I've said it before but make no apology for repeating................only use top quality brake shoes, the cheap ones are too hard and have a lower coefficient of friction.

[alexmcguffie]

I've always found Mintex M1144 shoes to be very good. Work well from cold and don't fade too much on Lake District 1:4's!

One to avoid like the plague is EBC. They claim to give better performance but are terrible!

[IslipMinor]

I have heard lots of complaints about EBC, especially dust.

I use Mintex 1155's and have yet to fade them, despite some very severe braking on Alpine passes and numerous tracks!

[alexmcguffie]

Dust is the least of EBCs problems. Poor pedal feel and very bad vibrations with medium pedal pressure. I'd never touch them again.

Minted 1155's are the next step up with a higher temp rating. Not sure if the Mu is any greater though. We'll be boiling the brake fluid next

[MorrisMinor-65-1000]

I have heard lots of complaints about EBC, especially dust.

There is no inherent inadequacy with EBC's 'colour stuff' brake pads. The problem is that they don't make the small print big enough! Their pads are Kevlar-based, which generate excessive gasses and fine dust under friction. This forms either an air cushion or a lubricating film of fine dust (they can't tell me which) which causes rapid brake fade. The most effective solution is to have the brake medium (discs or drums) micro-grooved (ie, left with a less fine finish after machining) to allow the gasses to escape.
I've recently bought a new set of drums from Andrew Eggleton which have this sort of finish on them. Without testing, they look like they could stand up to EBC type pads very well. But fitting these pads to old, smooth drums will undoubtedly lead to less than optimum performance.

The best thing I did to my brakes years ago was to replace the old worn drums with new. Made a fantastic difference.

To join this debate, I too had considered servo assisted front discs for my car when I first began the project, but have been suitably convinced - not least by BMCE - of the various disadvantages of such a setup, and advantages of the later 8" drums I have on my 1098. The most convincing factors for me (forgive me, can't remember who or where it was said) was the much much smaller friction pad area on Midget pads vs the 8" shoes, and the fact that (the 1098 at least) appears to be appropriately braked for its weight.

I've experienced issues with over-braking with my Rover 2000, and don't wish to introduce the same problem to another car unnecessarily. The P6 is drastically over-braked for its weight. It has servo-assisted discs on all four wheels - 10 inch at the front, 11 inch at the back, with 3-pot calipers, and narrow 165 section tyres on 5J wheels.
The effect in a car that weighs just 1200kg, with minimal unsprung weight thanks to IRS and inboard brakes, is a near-deadly level of lock-up at even moderate road speeds when braking suddenly. I eventually solved the issue by fitted not-inexpensive Dunlop SP's to 6J wheels from a later car, allowing me to get 195 section tyres on it (with slight mods to the suspension links). Overall things are much better, but it will still lock up on a greasey wet surface.

My advice to anybody thinking about brakes would be "fit discs if you want to, but learn how to cadence brake regardless. There WILL be a time when you're called on to do it, and sitting with your foot mashed on the pedal certainly won't stop you any quicker in a 4-wheel slide, no matter how good the discs are! They've already done their job, what's going to kill you is the lack of traction from such little weight over such skinny tyres!"
I think the same can be said for many cars of this period. In my eyes, introducing additional performance in one area of a system is only going to expose inadequacies in other areas that can't cope with the additional oompf. If the whole system is reasonably harmonious in standard form, stick with it!

[IslipMinor]

Not sure if the Mu is any greater though. We'll be boiling the brake fluid next!

The Mu for 1155 is very similar to 1144 up to around 400°C, but after that is higher than 1144, and holds on to the high level up to around 700°C versus 500°C for 1144. Cold performance is much the same, i.e. very good, unlike the good 'ole days of Ferodo DS11 pads and VG95 rear linings, and no servo! Great once warmed up, but until that ???

I use AP Racing DOT 5.1 AP fluid - dry boiling point is 269°C, versus 230°C for DOT 4 and 205°C for DOT 3. Gives some reassurance that there is a bit more headroom to work in.

[ampwhu]

fitting a servo and discs to mine was the best upgrade I ever made.